Originally written by Jim Van der Veen on 12/5/2008 12:19 PM
Ok, so I took the front wheel to the shop for a balance test. It was fairly well balanced, but they found the front wheel bearings to be shot. As the tire was starting to wear (more than 20K on an 880) I had a new tire and bearings put in and a fresh balance. Took it home and installed everything, and guess what, it still wobbled. I rode last night to work on I95 to get some smooth pavement and some speed. The wobble decreased as the speed went up, but not entirely. Came home and went to bed. Got up this morning and rode to Costco. It wobbled like crazy, but I noticed it seemed to be the sidecar wobbling the bike. I got home and just happened to look at the hacks tire. a 15" by as wide as 2" chunk of tread all the way down to the steel core was missing. I guess that could cause a wobble. Found a replacement tire and getting it mounted tomorrow morning. Everything should be good as new. Now why didn't one of you, my brothers and sisters, tell me to check the hack's tire???
Uber, as dumb as they come.
Probably you should check the sidecar tire. LOL. Whooda thunk it?
Getting a new tire tomorrow. Can't wait. You should see the missing patch from the original tire. I guess 60K is asking a bit much. Tow in wore it down.
uber
Lonnie....
Same here, inside tread, due to toe in, I am sure, but hey, 60K, not too bad. Just dumb on my part not to look. Find me a damper to my specs.
Wobbles that are a real problem are not that common on sidecar rigs although a lot of them do exhibit a headshake at slower speeds. Some riders tolertate this headshake easily with experience and forgo mounting a damper. Some prefer a damper to get rid of this irritation rather than learning to deal awith it.Keeping a grip on the bars and elarning not to ride at that certain speed can do wonders as far as riding without a damper goes.
Most headshakes are beleived by many to be initiated by the sidecar wheel. IThis is of course if other issues that cause wobbles and headshakes are not evident. ( tire issues including tire pressure, fork issues, wheel bearings, swingarm bearings, steering head bearings, Loose bearings in any suspension area. mounts flexing and/bad mounts.
Uber, don't feel bad about no seeing the sidecar tire problem. Some will say, and rightfully so , that sidecarists need to check their mounts , tires etc all th etime. This is true but soemtimes things that seem like they shoudl be obvious can slip by. I have had that happen on a rear tire that I looked at and felt was okay but ended upo blowing the tire not long afterwards. If anything all that has happened here reinforces the fact that we all need to look and look closely at any and all things that can become an issue later on.
Gary Haynes has done seminars on this and has written about it in Hack'd Magazine numerous times. It is important. Sometiems symptoms(warning signs) surface pretty good prior to a real issue and sometimes not.
Got the tire on and old Uber is back on the road. No shakes or wobbles. Just straight tracking down the highway of life. I saved the tire and will take a picture of it and post on this thread. If I can figure out how. When you see it you too will be amazed at how i could miss it.
Good news Uber! Hey at least though all of this you know everything else is in decent shape.
here is a very good diagram on putting on a vw steering dampner-- go to sidestrider.com and click on steering dampner.-- I may put one on my rig
here is a diagram if it turns out-- best to go to sidestrider to get more details
Personally, I don't care for the VW style if you spend a lot of time in city traffic or at slow speeds. It really makes steering a chore until you get up to about 30 mph. The better(pronounced Much More Expensive)ones tend to be very easy until they meet an oscillation. They can sometimes be a trick to mount though. http://www.exoticsportbike.com/arrow_steering_damper.htm
This one mounts below the gas tank, between the frame and triple tree.
Originally written by SidecarMike on 12/17/2008 6:15 AM
Personally, I don't care for the VW style if you spend a lot of time in city traffic or at slow speeds. It really makes steering a chore until you get up to about 30 mph. The better(pronounced Much More Expensive)ones tend to be very easy until they meet an oscillation. They can sometimes be a trick to mount though. http://www.exoticsportbike.com/arrow_steering_damper.htm
This one mounts below the gas tank, between the frame and triple tree.
The more expensive steering dampers that are made of billet aluminum and therefore obviously "better" are not just expensive they are ridiculously exorbitant. For example, from the link that you provided a damper for a CB600F Honda Hornet sells for $329.99 plus another $169.99 for the installation kit. That's $499.98 plus tax if any and shipping. That's out of sight!
I guess one reason I never have a problem with the VW style on my HD is that I never spend much time in traffic. Harley sells their damper for close to $100. It's really a Brazilian-made VW damper and it's the same as the ones that the auto stores sell for $29.95 or so.
The way the damper is mounted on the Harley, it is centered at the rear of the front fork with a very short length of leverage operating it. Mounted as it is, it really doesn't move very far so it's not all that bothersome at low speed. The links above show the damper mounted on the outside of the fork, fairly far away from the center with a much longer leverage distance. This would cause the damper to move farther for any given movement of the fork and thus have greater resistance, at least the way I see it.
I guess some folks will pay $500 for a steering damper. I prefer to spend my money on other things.....such as food, clothing and housing. LOL.
gnm, or Gnome, whatever....
Do you have a part number on your damper? I have shopped NAPA, but they don't have one as long as mine. Also, the strange named fitting on the one end, does it have to be crimped on (swaged) or do they screw on? I agree with you totally that the less travel, the better it is. Plus, I do not have the geometry that it takes to follow the example. Send me something if you have it.
Thanks!
uber
Originally written by gnm109 on 12/17/2008 9:50 AM
Originally written by SidecarMike on 12/17/2008 6:15 AM
Personally, I don't care for the VW style if you spend a lot of time in city traffic or at slow speeds. It really makes steering a chore until you get up to about 30 mph. The better(pronounced Much More Expensive)ones tend to be very easy until they meet an oscillation. They can sometimes be a trick to mount though. http://www.exoticsportbike.com/arrow_steering_damper.htm
This one mounts below the gas tank, between the frame and triple tree.The more expensive steering dampers that are made of billet aluminum and therefore obviously "better" are not just expensive they are ridiculously exorbitant. For example, from the link that you provided a damper for a CB600F Honda Hornet sells for $329.99 plus another $169.99 for the installation kit. That's $499.98 plus tax if any and shipping. That's out of sight!
I guess one reason I never have a problem with the VW style on my HD is that I never spend much time in traffic. Harley sells their damper for $129.95. It's really a Brazilian-made VW damper and it's the same as the ones that the auto stores sell for $29.95.
The way the damper is mounted on the Harley, it is centered at the rear of the front fork with a very short length of leverage operating it. Mounted as it is, it really doesn't move very far so it's not all that bothersome at low speed. The links above show the damper mounted on the outside of the fork, fairly far away from the center with a much longer leverage distance. This would cause the damper to move farther for any given movement of the fork and thus have greater resstance, at least the way I see it.
I guess some folks will pay $500 for a steering damper. I prefer to spend my money on other things.....such as food, clothing and housing. LOL.
I have two of them, both from ebay. One was $14 with shipping and the other was $19. Both are adjustable to give as much or as little damping as is necessary, without adding the drag at low speed. I bought them to fix a problem on my Valkyrie but discovered it to be caused by a wheel bearing instead.
The material isn't what make them better, the fact that they can be adjusted and that the whole thing is about the size of a good cigar is why I prefer them.
But you still are not giving parts numbers, manufacturers or any other way to track them down and buy one.
Uber
Originally written by Jim Van der Veen on 12/17/2008 5:24 PM
But you still are not giving parts numbers, manufacturers or any other way to track them down and buy one.
Uber
Here are part numbers and sources:
The Harley steering damper (made in Brazil) is P/N 87141-83. they liost for around $100, a little less than I mentinoed earlier. Don't buy one from Harley, though.
The VW Steering Damper: Available at many VW aftermarket parts sources:
http://www.jcwhitney.com/VW-Steering-Stabilizers-Dampers/600007511.jcw
http://www.prostreetonline.com/m/volkswagen_steering-damper.asp
Just go to Google and type in keywords "VW steering damper". There are a couple of different model cars that they fit. Mostly any Beetle from around the late 60'sd to the early 70's would be OK. They are the same as the one that HD uses. they are ideal for a sidecar due to the low prices and availability from VW aftermarket stores and online. They are also very easy to mount. One end has a typical shock absorber mount with a rubber bushing. The other end has a metric thread at a 90 degree angle. you might have to use a piece of strap metal and adapt that end but it can be done.
The ones I have and all that I've seen are sealed hydraulic units and are non-adjustable.
Good luck.
