Background:
We've recently returned to Am Samoa after 9 years in Fiji, but with a (currently) 5 year old son. Although native-born US citizens, we haven't been to the US mainland since '99, and our son not at all. My riding experience has been chops in the late 70s (residual post-VN war anger, I'm much better now, thank you!), and scootering in Honolulu in the early 90s.
My wife and I are long-time, long distance, cruising sailors, and are used to coping with traveling (although being in a country where English is commonly spoken will be a treat! 🙂 ).
The thought:
The general plan right now is for mid 2014 to somehow to buy a Burgman 650 or Silver Wing, have a hack hung on it in Florida, visit with my wife's rellies there, then take it cross country to California (my rellies), then stick it into one of my employer's containers and ship it back here (Samoa).
Although mechanically adroit in a number of different media (I've built two wooden boats, one welded aluminum one), because of logistics and time constraints (we don't want to do a sprint across the states), I think that I'd be better buying new than used.
The scooter should be a bit safer with the lower CG, and my son's lower weight (we are physically small people), we can carry more 'junk' in the hack for ballast and comfort whilst traveling.
Your job is to shoot holes in this idea!
Thanks in advance,
Michael
It sounds good. Where in Florida will you start from? I maybe able to help. Sorry I am not a hole shooter.
Michael,
With the Burgman or Silverwing the wife would need to be in the hack and son on the pillion for a better balanced rig. 3 up with baggage is quite a load for any 650cc powered rig. I would look at 1100ccs minimum for a good tractable cross country rig. Lots of hills and mountains between FL and CA.
It can be done with the 600cc or 650cc tug but you are limited to secondary roads without good freeway power.
If time is not in the equation, no problem since the smaller displacement tug would be a better choice for use in your final destination; Samoa.
I agree that new is the way to go here.
Good Luck, hope your plan works out.
Lonnie
Northwest Sidecars
Okay, 3rd attempt to post a reply here!
I'd question how you'd ever have enough room in a single hack rig for 2 adults and a fairly good-sized child, enough for a cross country run? Figuring a change of clothes, handful of tools, some weather protection, snacks & drinks and maybe more, that's mighty cramped.
Also gotta figure that weather may not co-operate at all even on the southern route, so protection/shelter needed there because it can be a l-o-n-g ways to next planned stop, overnite or otherwise. I've made that trip several times, in a sort of van, not on a bike, it's still a long haul.
Another factor is your road miles per day, usually a lot shorter on a bike or rig. This adds exposure time on the road compared to a cross country run in an enclosed vehicle. Plus hour after hour for at least a week for a 6 year old to sit quietly and happily in a tightly cramped space for days on end, ummm, I dunno?! Mommy's lap might be awfully numb in a short time.
You might strongly consider hauling a trailer behind then sell it before heading back to your new home. One thing that's imperative: please be absolutely sure your wife can safely manage operating the rig should anything happen to you along the way!
Another remote possibility is to be able to set up a tour with some others on bikes who also want to make that trip. You'd have some backups and support along the way? That's maybe not so far fetched afterall...?
One more: unless you plan to go ripping across country with the throttle twisted wide open, remember to calculate extra time for 'necessary' stops, leg stretches, meals, sleep, unexpected delays etc. especially with a 6 year old aboard.
BTW, should you do it, on the southern route in Texas, New Mexico & Arizona they just love to do their big road projects in summertime, where 20-50 miles of road is gravel, mud, dirt, clouds of choking dust and general insanity, check long ahead of time. Be safe, hope the best to you guys and congratulations on your new home.
Sounds like a great plan to me! The only hole I can see is the one hack'n mentioned but I dont like interstates anyway so it wouldn't bother me!
Not a bad plan but also, "Not for the timid".
You will be pushing the limits of the capacity and highways would probably be out of the question. Lonnie was right in principle about loading but the underlying issue is really not "who sits where" but making certain that you don't overload the bike compared to the sidecar. Remember, basically half of the weight of the passengers on the bike lies outside the tip-over line. Try to concentrate the weight inside an imaginary line that connects the three tire contact patches. I'd recommend that you get a copy of "How to Drive a Sidecar Outfit" [commonly called "The Yellow Book"] and give it a read. It covers all the physics issues. Also, go to the files area on this site and read the books that are available free there.
Lonnie said that there are a lot of hills and mountains between Florida and California. I haven't actually driven the whole route [but lots of parts of it] but I'm pretty sure that if you stick to a southern track you won't hit anything that's insurmountable. The road around the Gulf over to Texas is all pretty flat.
Good luck and please feel free to ask any specific questions here. We have folks scattered all over the country who can provide good local information if you need it.
BTW, if you haven't settled on a sidecar, consider Texas Sidecars. They have a well developed sidecar for scooters and they are located in Leonard Texas so you could stop for a service half way through the trip. No, I'm not an employee and everybody else makes good products. I mention of Texas Sidecars is simply based on their location and good reputation.
First, thank you for your time with your responses.
The weight/gear issue had been nagging at me. The combined weight of my wife. son, and I will be in the order of 300#, so that does give us a bit of an advantage on the hp/weight curve. In addition, one of the two thoughts for buying new is that we would be buying a warrantee, which should cut the required tool inventory considerably.
The trailer is a good idea as well (even planning on motels, you're all right, we'll need minimum camping gear for bad wx), but mass is still mass; would a 'soft' trailer hold up to this sort of thing? Would a hitch be best attached to the tug, or a strut midpoint between the tug and the car, so as the left wheel of the trailer follows the tug wheels? I'd imagine that getting passed by a road train with the entire rig will have to be experienced to be believed!
We wouldn't even consider doing a putt like this on the freeways (where possible). Going relatively slow to see the land and meet people is the purpose, and we speak the language as well (I grew up in a barrio in Southern California, and lived a year in MX in the 80s, so although rusty, using Spanish isn't a drama either).
We're not wedded to the thought of a Hannigan, but it would solve quite a number of logistics issues, as my brother lives just north of Nashville, and we could camp with him when the new hack is being readied and mounted by Hannigan, then do a trial run down to Florida (FIL lives in Del Ray beach, he moved there after he retired from his practice in Cape Coral). I've looked for Texas sidecar dealers in Florida, and didn't see any listed (or advertised); can someone advise?
Thinking of which, on the sidecar itself, as our son is our only child, no spares, and at our ages there isn't going to be another, has anyone ever put a roll cage on a sidecar (save for Asian taxi's)? A rotating bubble type caution light above the driver's line of sight?
Again, thanks to all for your input. This isn't something we're running out to do because with all of the logistics involved, an 18 month leadtime may be a bit short!
Just an idea, see harbor freight Tag Along Trailer.
Since I have seen a couple of Argentiniens riding from down south of Patagonia through a long Amazonas track to top Alaska in a 1928 wood spoked oldtimer I do not believe in any if, whens and buts. Their son got born in the middle of their journey.
http://www.argentinaalaska.com/blog/Welcome-alaska
try to get their book. great inspiration.
http://www.argentinaalaska.com/blog/video
Myself I hope to make one or two good journeys the next year with my 17 1/2 year old , means the one year that starts tomorrow.
As of traveling to Norway in Dezember 86 and through about 25 countries (about 21 by motorcycle) (Well I have to admit most before I got married)
I think the whens and ifs come from the ladies of the family and all starts in the head.
A couple of french endourists got the price of simplicity crossing Northafrica when I met them on the way back in Istanbul.
A bread, a bottle of wine, 1 set of spare clothes, a tooth brush each, 1 sleeping bag for both and the girlfriend on the back seat. All they needed for a 3 month trip.
They laughed utterly about me, the ugly Bosch pulling all those tools and spares for a simple Turkey trip.
Weeks and years later I realized they were right. light weight goes better.
Attitude makes the difference.
As light as possible but as usefull and as prepared for most probabilities is my goal.
But at the end all comes down to:
The track is the goal.
and a warm hearted personell contact to people is all it is about.
Now it will be on me to teach that to Thomas.
13 1/2 hours left in the old year.
Forget about the holes. tie up your sails and go for it...
Myself I still want to try to mount a sail onto the rig....
On, On.
Sven from Costa Rica 🙂 🙂
"The trailer is a good idea as well (even planning on motels, you're all right, we'll need minimum camping gear for bad wx), but mass is still mass; would a 'soft' trailer hold up to this sort of thing? Would a hitch be best attached to the tug, or a strut midpoint between the tug and the car, so as the left wheel of the trailer follows the tug wheels? I'd imagine that getting passed by a road train with the entire rig will have to be experienced to be believed!"
I have no direct experience hauling a trailer behind a bike or hack rig. That said, the most common opinion is that it's best to have the hitch between the bike and the chair. I've done hundreds of thousands of miles hauling a 27' travel trailer behind my truck and I sure can't imagine towing one with it behind and hanging out beside, beyond the tow rig wheels.
Others here may have comment on whether the 650 will have adequate power for a hack and a trailer too?
I like the idea of a trailer. Mount it midway between the tug and hack tire tracks. Not only will it be more stable, it won't increase the overall width of your setup. Back road lane width can be an issue. Others can give you advice on trailer brakes as I've never driven with a trailer on my rig.
Since you are new to hacks, getting a new, reliable, warrented and professionally assembled rig is a good idea. A poor assembly is not only unsafe, it will eat tires causing you to possibly make extra unexpected and expensive repair stops. You may want to have a few tools available as a warrenty won't fight off the cold if you break down in an exposed area and help is hours/days away.
Also pop for a front suspension that is made for sidecar rigs. Sidecars are directly-steered as opposed to counter-steered like a bike. There will be no lazy leans into a sweeping curve, you have to WANT to make the turn and throw some deliberate effort into it. This will likely mean that the tug can't safely be a 2-wheeler again without reverting back to a counter-steering friendly front.
Also pop for the electric lean so you can trim your rig from the saddle. You'll appreciate it, particularly once you get 'er home and your rig loading will be more variable.
Be prepared for sticker shock, a new rig with all these options ain't guna be cheap!
OldSchool_IsCool - 12/31/2012 12:47 PM
<>Also pop for a front suspension that is made for sidecar rigs. Sidecars are directly-steered as opposed to counter-steered like a bike. There will be no lazy leans into a sweeping curve, you have to WANT to make the turn and throw some deliberate effort into it. This will likely mean that the tug can't safely be a 2-wheeler again without reverting back to a counter-steering friendly front.
Also pop for the electric lean so you can trim your rig from the saddle. <>
Old School, Do you have any sources for those mods for a Bergman scooter??
'fraid I don't Al.
OldSchool_IsCool - 12/31/2012 12:47 PM
... front suspension that is made for sidecar rigs...
Al Olme - 12/31/2012 12:55 PM
... sources for those mods for a Bergman scooter??
We installed a 5-degree modified triple tree on Jena's 2006 Burgman/Texas Ranger sidecar rig from: http://www.customtripletrees.com/TREES/SUZUKI/suzuki.html in Illinois -- steering is much easier now.
The Ranger sidecar works well with the Burgman. Jena has successfully traveled several 250-300 mile days at 45mph-60mph via "small" state highways, but only with Corkie the dog as a sidecar passenger. Luggage space would be quite limited for 3 folks with our combination -- luggage could be enhanced by a "top box" on the Burgman and a rack on the sidecar to strap a waterproof duffle.
I have seen a Burgman "solo" pulling a Lees-ure Lite camping trailer without issue. Despite the power mode on the CVT transmission, I just don't think it would be good to pull a trailer with a Burgman sidecar rig, as I suspect the drivetrain is already taxed doing one or the other.
Here's a photo of Jena & Tatum (10 years old) playing games at Caddo Lake back in 2010 -- before the steering modification:
Lee
MB5+TW200+CRF250L+GTV300+INT650
XL883R w/Texas Ranger Sidecar
Zuma 50F + Burgman w/Texas Sidecar<Mrs. SwampFox
Interesting stuff Lee! THX!
