What is the 'optimal' wheel offset and wheel location for installing a Sputnik to an F650GS w/Dauntless frame. By 'Optimali I mean it will be my starting base.
Figure A on attached: Distance from frame to hack frame?
Figure B on attached: Wheel offset between rear and hack wheel axles?
Thanks in advance,
felix
PS: I did search the site first before posting.
I'm unsure of any optimum but wheel lead around 15% and separation of 12" frame to frame seems about right for a lot of rigs.
Less lead steers easier, more lead adds stability at speed.
Wider track is more stable but harder to turn.
Lonnie
Northwest Sidecars
Thanks Lonnie
I did find references to 2/3 bike 1/3 side car as well as 8" to 10" offset to start off with. I'll start of with 8" and work from there.
The frame to frame distance will come in handy.
Thanks again,
Felix
Call Jay at Dauntless and see what he says.
Too littl ewhel elad on a dual sport rig without a swaybar will be a challenge.
Narrow track width is less stable but can be good ofgf rOAd.
I did send Jay at Dauntless an email regarding this topic. I'll post what he has to say when he responds.
On a dual sport type rig you will want more wheel lead for more stability in left handers.
The track width being center of sidecar wheel to center of bike is what helps stability a lot too.
Personally I woudl go for 12" lead and no less than 48" track width and add a swaybar if it is to be run on hard packed surfaces much. Others may disagree.
Originally written by claude #3563 on 9/2/2008 3:33 PM
On a dual sport type rig you will want more wheel lead for more stability in left handers.
The track width being center of sidecar wheel to center of bike is what helps stability a lot too.
Personally I woudl go for 12" lead and no less than 48" track width and add a swaybar if it is to be run on hard packed surfaces much. Others may disagree.
The 48 inch track width should be ideal.
Looks like I don't have all the right parts. The sputnik was outfitted from a Funduro which has a different frame setup than the later 650GS.
Originally written by krellheat on 9/2/2008 8:44 PM
Looks like I don't have all the right parts. The sputnik was outfitted from a Funduro which has a different frame setup than the later 650GS.
Google Dauntless motors and CALL Jay 🙂
Jay found some spare parts for me--they are UPSing their way to Connecticut. AS soon as I get them installed I will post photos.
Just as a point to consider, my Honda GL650/Dneper has 15 inches of lead. I'm told thats a lot of lead. It's very stable at 80 mph going straight.However, I find that the front wheel wants to wash out on hard left handers. I have learned to plan ahead when making any turn. On the left ones, especially gravel & snow, I pull myself up on the tank to transfer some weight to the front. With sidecars, everything is a compromise. I'm sure any decision you make will have some sort of technique adapted to make it work. What ever you choose will most likely be a lot of fun.
Originally written by Mark in Idaho on 9/9/2008 8:46 AM
Just as a point to consider, my Honda GL650/Dneper has 15 inches of lead. I'm told thats a lot of lead. It's very stable at 80 mph going straight.However, I find that the front wheel wants to wash out on hard left handers. I have learned to plan ahead when making any turn. On the left ones, especially gravel & snow, I pull myself up on the tank to transfer some weight to the front. With sidecars, everything is a compromise. I'm sure any decision you make will have some sort of technique adapted to make it work. What ever you choose will most likely be a lot of fun.
Excessive lead? Picture an automobile with a right front wheel that does not steer. The more lead we run the closer we approach that scenario.
Picture a car with no right front wheel but two rear ones. Stable? Nope. Too little lead appraches that scenario.
Where the compromise is best for a given rig is the answer.
Claude mentions the one front wheel and two back wheels as a concept idea.
I may add that that comes close to the MZ-Superelastic rig I had.
End of story was that I mounted a (Nylon) or PE Pad to the right corner of the sidecars metal nose in order to slip in hard left bends and not catch the ground and flip. (Rest of cornering control I did with the butt - not for nothing I had to straighten out the bike and sidecar frame once and again - that rig was a real toy ...and the driver (me) a public danger ... those were days, sighhhh....)
It worked well for white faces of the sidecar passengers!
On a rig for the dirt I am sure that would not be a good idea to copy.
Best regards and have fun with your project.
Sven Peter
I have received the parts from Jay at Dauntless and installed the frame and hack this weekend. A test run to get gas for the bike, I found the bike handles well on the straight aways. No shimmy, no crabbing. Ooh what fun it was. I guess I got some what lucky after 4 hours of adjusting and measuring and repeating it again a few times. Just need to finish installing the bling that came with the Sputnik then I'll post some photos.
At the the gas station one person came over and told me about the R65 with the hack he use to ride in the 70s. A neighbor of his has a Ural and he is thinking about getting back into motorcycling w/hack of course.
