Hey all! WOoo hooo, looks like I lucked out and found a rig! The tug (1980 Yamaha XS1100) runs, which is half the battle. There is some work needed. The tug needs a new battery, but the sidecar has a automobile battery and alternator in it...what are the pluses and minuses of such a set up? There is a driving light mounted on the sidecar, and what looks like an accessory plug in as well as brake, marker and turn signal lights.
Why wont the big battery power the tug? Ive just done a clutch and fuel pump on a BMW R1100 RSL and the thing still runs well, but if Im going to FUBAR something on a bike its going to be the electricals.
Any words of wisdom will be greatly appreciated! THANKS AND RIDE/DRIVE SAFE.
Tom
im thinking of putting additional battery in my sidecar.thinking it would lower the load on the bike battery,since i have many additional lights.
dont know if i just have to run lines from trunk to bike battery or if something else is needed.
It depends a lot on what you want the car battery to do. If it's supplimental power for lights, heated grips & clothes, air horns, coffee pots, hair dryer's etc, then you will want to wire in an isolator relay so that your starter doesn't try to draw the 50-60 amps through the relatively small wires that likely connect the aux battery to your tug.
If you want to use the car battery to start your bike or to eliminate the bike's on-board battery, then the wiring from the aux battery to your bike will need to be of substantial size and length. Ideally, you will also want to fuse these lines. Unfused lines, particularly lines that are run some distance, poses risks of uncontrolled shorts. A fuse that can handle starter curent isn't common or cheap.
So I guess it's a question of intent and budget.
Thanks for reply.just want to supplement bike battery for load.guess will have to isolate.
also fuse hot side?
yes, fuse the hot side. I'm not sure how much load you want to allow. A 30-amp fuse with 12-gauge wire and a max wire length of 12 feet might work for you (any electrical techs and/or engineers want to chime in here?). I've seen wire gauge calculators on the internet like this one http://beta.circuitwizard.bluesea.com/ that can help you calculate the specifics of what you need.
The fuse is basically the weak link in an electrical circuit. If it exceeds what your wires can safely carry, then your wires become the weak link. Fuses blow quickly, wires burn slowly, often leading to flame! The length and size of the wires a fuse can protect will determine the max safe amperage rating of the fuse.
you will want to wire in an isolator relay so that your starter doesn't try to draw the 50-60 amps through the relatively small wires that likely connect the aux battery to your tug.
can you or someone provide a schematic and possible parts list for this? id like to add (at the least) another motorcycle battery to the hack for lighting and powerpoint and while i can wire it and do all of the connections and such, ive no idea where to tie into the tug (for charging purposes)...
Fortunately I have an EE for a neighbor.ill make sure to run the wire size past him.
thanks for the help
Hiya, I'm running two 36 amp/hour 12v AGM sealed glassmat batteries outboard behind the seat in my Motorvation Formula II. Mostly because the rear upper strut bracket took up a lot of the stock bikes battery location. I wired it all up with an OFF-#1-COMBINE switch which isolates the batteries. #1 battery dedicated to the bike ('85 VF1000R) and the other for "house" loads like extra lighting, 12v outlets etc. There is an automatic charging diode in there too which regulates which battery receives alternator output depending on state of draw/discharge. The switch and diode are Blue Seas items from the marine industry and were on sale together for around a hundred bucks.
I really liked the idea of being able to completely depower the whole system or combine the batteries if I needed that extra oomph for startup, like happens sometimes. I didn't fool around with wire size and ran everything with 6 gauge, copper terminals and shrink tubed everything.
A couple thousand miles in and it's been flawless. The rig carries six times the juice of the stock in bike setup and the small physical size of the AGM batteries doesn't tax the alternator, which is bone stock, trying to pump charge to a huge battery.
And there's no venting or spill hazard. Nice for when I pulled the seat out and slept in the chair, with the top up, in the rain. The batteries were literally right next to my head!
Check a West Marine catalog, twenty-five years in boatyards is finally starting to pay off!
Thanks for reply.ill check them out
There is good advice in the posts above about isolating the battery. One + that I see as well is the ballast factor a car battery will provide for the hack.
That's an added benefit provided u use a car battery.will have to see what donor batteries are available this winter when im doing thisthis.
It all depends a lot on what you want the car power to do. If it's supplemental power for alerts, energized cases & outfits, air horns, coffee bins, hair dryer's etc, then you will want to series in an isolator convey so that your starting doesn't try to appeal to the 50-60 amps through the relatively little electric that likely sleep the aux power to your tug.
Mountainmonkey - 9/26/2011 9:36 PM Hiya, ... There is an automatic charging diode in there too which regulates which battery receives alternator output depending on state of draw/discharge. The switch and diode are Blue Seas items from the marine industry and were on sale together for around a hundred bucks. ...
How would I wire the charging diode? I see a fitting on the switch, but where do you run the wire too?
What charging diode? Such solutions perforce are idiot-proof and therefore not the best you can give to your beloved bike 🙂 Charging diode(s) is(are) built-in into your bike's regulator.
You may connect additional battery (or external as only) just in place of original. "plus" to hot wire, "minus" to cold wire and to frame (supposing that you have standard bike with "minus" on the ground/frame).
There are important questions for big battery, before buying it:
-will it give you any advantages?
-is it safe with your bike's electricity?
-energy-ballance matters....
Let me explain. Why do You need (or you think you need) stronger battery? More lamps/lights, heated grips, better starting possibilities (you don't have kickstarter), winter matters? Bigger battey is less vulnerable for overload with bunch of energy receivers, but it's true only if you have chance to fully charge it with your bike's alternator.
Energy receivers generally divide into two groups. Constant and momentary ones. Constant are all that you use all time you drive:
-ignition system in majority of bikes (yeah, I'm so lucky and have separate coil for it :D)
-taillights
-frontlights (in some countries all day)
-position lights in some countries
Momentary ones:
-turn lights
-electrical starter
-honk
-stop lights
-etc.
Accessories like foglights, CB-radio, heated grips, GPS charger etc belong to one or other group depending on your use.
You MUST have enough power to power all constant receivers + some reserve for battery recharge (after engine starting or idling in traffic jam). Otherwise you kill any battery in short time.
Now if you use bigger battery, it of course can give you ability of powering foglights for an hour or heated grips for few evening hours but you must use them with knowledge that they drain your battery and you must be sure that you can recharge the battery in few hours of driving with a minimum of constant receivers turned on. Or must be really sure that you may recharge the big battery from external source after intensive use, otherwise you will not start your engine tomorrow 🙁
So, let's calculate some example. You have battery ignition system (may eat up to 10W), 5W taillight, 5W sidecar's taillight, 55W H4 frontlight. And 36Wh battery drained in 2/3, cause you are after night ride with heated grips and momentary uses of foglight. So you must give 24Wh to your battery. As "charging factor" is about 1.4 for lead/acid battery, you must give 24Wh*1.4=33.6Wh to your battery, still powering about 75W of receivers (and recharge every ounce of energy that eg. turnlights have eaten). If you have older bike, it can have 85-90W electricity. So you have about 10 watts of power left.
It means that (in theory) you must drive 3 hours 25 mins constantly, with average speed, to recharge your battery. In practice, the more charge left in battery, the less charge it receives from charging system. So if you have theoretically 10 watts left, it may take 5-6 hours of constant driving to recharge battery, not 3:25. Sad but true - your configuration isn't self-sufficient to take advantages of bigger battery and bunch of accessories.
You may(if possible) install stronger alternator or weaker frontlight. Alternatively you may carry your battery charger and connect it to power outlet every time you have chance, but it's a half-solution.
You should do such calculation with your bike, and then decide what accessories and how big battery you can connect.
Safety questions:
-are your cables thick enough to survive bigger currents?
-the same questions with electrical connectors inside your ignition switch
Probably you should use some relays and additional, thick cables to receivers.
To isolate battery's hot cable You may use such pipe (I don't know its english name). It is available in reinforced versiion too.
c64club - 11/8/2011 1:54 AM What charging diode?
Read MountainMonkey's description above. He is using a marine battery switch with a charging diode. I merely asked where he hooked up the diode.
I carry a battery to run a Bipap and camping items. I have considered charging it from the bike with the same kind of switch, as I have a couple of them hanging in the garage.
