5 deg.Raked Tree

May I throw a wrench into the mix?

Have you ever ridden a bike with it installed? My Goldwing is the first one I've had with a modified fork, though far from the first sidecar outfit. I'm not sure I like it.

It is definitely easier to steer, but it's almost too easy. When I first test rode, I thought something was loose. It wandered all over the road. After double checking everything, I found nothing out of spec.

Now that I've put about 800 miles on, it's getting better, but I've found I have to pay much closer attention. So much so that I wear myself out. 300 miles on this feels like 500 on the Valkyrie, Harley, or Guzzi rigs. Not physically tired, but mentally drained.

For example, the other day I saw a deer in the field to my left. He was close enough to the road, that I slowed down and kept an eye on him. Without realizing it, I drifted into the left lane while watching the deer. I've discovered the same thing on the Interstate. If I pay too much attention to a billboard, I find myself drifting toward it. I never had that happen on my other outfits. It's kind of like driving a sports car with power steering. You just don't get the feel of the road.

Mike I've got a steerritr tree on my Triumph America now, about a year and a half. I really like it. I'm going to put a diffrent tub on my America. And put the Texas Ranger on my Harley.Rudy

SidecarMike, the 5* tree on our Sportster is not a twitchy as you describe on the Wing, although I did tend to over-steer to the left for the 100 miles or so.

Rudy, I can't comment as I don't have a ...Glide, but you have experience with Steerite, and we've both read good things here about Liberty. Hmm...This comment doesn't help you the least bit, does it??

I have a 91 GL1500, with a Escort sidecar. I bought it as a complete non running rig, and just today finally got to ride it. I have no sidecar experence, it came equipped with a California Sidecar triple tree and extended tubes, and is very easy to steer. I feel the same way that Sidecarmike does, it is too light steering, hard to keep it from wandering all over the road, and takes a lot of effort to keep it in the lane, but it does not pull to either side. The previous owner told me that it is a 4 1/2 degree triple tree.

Lloyd - 6/17/2011 12:38 AM

91 GL1500 with a Escort sidecar.... same way that Sidecarmike does, it is too light steering, hard to keep it from wandering all over the road, and takes a lot of effort to keep it in the lane, but it does not pull to either side....

Reckon tightening/re-torquing the steering head bearings would help??

I've had zero (0) problems with the Harleys with 5 degree trees. They also work fine without a damper.
Perhaps the GL's have a different frame neck angle than the Harleys and some of the raked trees do have a 6 degree rake, both of which could cause the difference in handling. The late GL's may end up with less actual trail than the Harleys. Too little trail while easing steering difficulty reduces the caster which is what makes a vehicle want to remain travelling a straight line and also helps the steering to self center after a turn. Too little trail and you lose this advantage. Too much trail and you work too hard.

Lonnie

Stick a steering dampner on your rigs.....cured my "wandering" problem....dampners cause a lot of disagreement on forums...but I ain`t proud!!! mine is great for Hiway speeds and IMHO at low speed it ain`t no problem unless you are a girlie boy...... (female hackers please ignore that!!!)

Mike....

SwampFox - 6/17/2011 7:49 AM

Lloyd - 6/17/2011 12:38 AM 91 GL1500 with a Escort sidecar.... same way that Sidecarmike does, it is too light steering, hard to keep it from wandering all over the road, and takes a lot of effort to keep it in the lane, but it does not pull to either side....

Reckon tightening/re-torquing the steering head bearings would help??

Mine doesn't wander. In fact,I can let go of the handlebars at Interstate speeds without a problem. It just steers way faster than I expected it to.

Mine is at the specs on the instruction sheet. Since it has new bearings and seats, I pulled it apart and double checked it after the first 500 miles.

It isn't caused by something loose, so I don't think a stabilizer would change anything. I think it will just take so getting used to.

The CSC Powertrak is a 4.5° change with 2.1" of trail reduction.

If I recall now...my steering felt kinda light after installing EZsteer....at the time I had a M/C tire on front and no dampner....Champion recommended tightening bearings beyond service manual specs in their instructions....which I had done.....installed car tire on front wheel....that helped alot....and as I mentioned installing steering dampner later was good for Hiway cruising.....
Mike......

on a hd it will be a absolute bear to handle without a raked tree

you CAN get it adjusted to track straight on a particular road [ie the crown so the road drains to the right and the bike will go straight] but when you go to pass somebody on the interstate the bike will want to turn left into the median

this CAN be overcome, if you have really good upper body strength its really no big deal

also if you never try to drive really fast its not a big deal, but with a passenger in the hack and a full load of crap with the cruise set on 80 on the freeway in the left lane in a right sweeper and a concrete wall - you will have the raked tree in in a month or less - ask me why i know this..........

i also get sore wrists so i installed a raked tree - make CERTAIN the swing by in the steering head bearings is set properly or a tiny bit tight

you also should look into a HD trike front end its very competitive price wise and wont mess with your warranty

to

I purchased my rig (GL1800/Escort) used with the Champion EZSteer installed. It also had a dampner installed at the time. Jay at DMC suggested the dampner was not really needed so I took that off and liked it much better. I like the way the rig steers, tracks straight. Only thing is on hard turns on loose surface the front tire has a tendency to want to slide. It has a motorcycle tire on the front, a car tire on the rear.

My rig has the stock fork tubes installed, some of you mention having longer fork tubes. I never thought about that and might explain why my bike sits a little lower than my prior GL1800 did (no sidecar). I thought it was weak front fork springs and replaced them along with a stiffer rear spring.

I have a GL1500/Champion Escort and have E-Z Steer, I think 6 degree. I have similar steering as Mike. It is so quick to react especially at freeway speeds or in windy conditions. I had used a damper before I had the modification and haven't needed it (for low speed front wheel wobble) but the other week I put it back on and went for a ride. It works ok at slow speeds but is way too stiff to react smoothly at speed. I took it off. Will, I didn't have the extentions for the forks but ordered a set online that are 1 and a half inches long. It sets the front end up better. fwiw Ralph

People should note that extending the front fork legs does counter act the actual trail by changing the geometry slightly. It isn't a huge amount but it does add trail to your rig, something you just paid money to get rid of. The steering head bearings should be torqued to 25 ft/lbs and left there, don't back it off and then torque to factory spec, it needs the additional drag/resistance to take away some of the responsiveness. If there was more trail than what the EZ Steer, Steerite, etc offer, then you would end up with a slight head shake as the tire tries to find it's sweet spot. If there is too much trail reduction, you would win races on a track but it will be horrible on the highways. So the sweet spot is needed. As for the dampers, there aren't just one or two dampers available. Find out the eye to eye length that works for your bike and then where it is mounted on the frame and the forks. Next, check out how stiff the damper is and factor that in to it's location. I have used a truck steering damper on a few bikes. Way too heavy for normal positions, but mounted vertically to the lower subframe and up to the lower triple clamp and the forks have a huge advantage over the damper, thus requiring a heavier damper. I always see dampers being mounted on the wheel axle or at 90deg to the forks. Not only will different positions offer different amounts of resistance, it can also induce horrible bump steer! This can go on and on but I'll leave it at that. If people want to see some pictures of dampers mounted in different ways, let me know, I'll provide a link to check out some photo albums, as long as the moderators don't mind if it's a business photo album.
-Brock Smith
Side Effects

There is a picture of my damper setup on my '08 HD StreetBob in my album. It is adjustable and seems OK to me . Ebay $110.00 > Since I used to like to go fast before the sidecar install I dropped the front end 2" . The bike handles very well at low and high speed . I don't go over the speed limit much any more . I got tired of getting punched in the arm by my wife ( ball and chain ).

Lance