Help me decide...

Buy a seperate bike and dedicate it to the sidecar. The myth about sidecars being easily removed and reinstalled is a nice thought, but never seems to be based in reality.

Try putting a car on the Bonneville and leaving it there. I rode for 20 years before I got my first sidecar, now I'm addicted. It seems that I never rode my solo bikes as much as I would have liked because I always had a need for the car to carry groceries or a case of beer or even lumber. With a sidecar I never drive my car when the weather permits because I can complete 99% of my errands with the hack. I have a solo available but rarely ride it due to my need of a sidecar. Check out RoadFilms album for some pictures of his Bonneville America with a Watsonian hack. It's a beautiful ride.

I should have mentioned that I don't want to do a permanent install on the Bonnie, as I love the way it handles in the turns. Any time I'm out for a pleasure cruise I try to grind a little more off of the pegs.

I'm wondering about what taking a 1,000 mile trip with the sidecar on will do to my tires. Could I get by with keeping a seperate rear wheel with squared off tire just for long trips?

I have read arguments for and against using the sidecar occasionally on a solo, but I haven't decided.

According to Lonnie, the Bonneville handles well with a Velorex 562 with out any modifications.

Wolfie, if it was reasonable to have a sidecar that went on and off easily, most if not all sidecar owners would do that. Or do you really think that no one else even tried that? Go ahead and repeat a mistake thats been made a thousand times before, and ignore the advise of a few hundred experienced riders. But Please report back on how well it worked out for you.

Wolfie, I pursued your 2nd option, got a Suzuki V Strom with a Ural sidecar, Connie and I just returned today to JAX today after a 1500 mile trip to the Keys (via Cocoa Beach, Miami, Naples, and Clearwater). Had a blast,I finally wore out the metzler ME880, it had 9500 miles. I replaced it with an Anakee dual sport tire, will probably get 5000 or so. I do carry a spare rear tire, for the reaons you mention, but in hindsight, it wouldn't be neccesary unless you planned really long trips. We had originally planned to take the Strom to Alaska, but we ended up getting a Goldwing for the really long trips (and it does have a car tire).

Originally written by Lunatic on 1/20/2008 8:20 PM

Wolfie, if it was reasonable to have a sidecar that went on and off easily, most if not all sidecar owners would do that. Or do you really think that no one else even tried that? Go ahead and repeat a mistake thats been made a thousand times before, and ignore the advise of a few hundred experienced riders. But Please report back on how well it worked out for you.

No, I don't think I'm the first one to think of it. As stated earlier, I've heard discussions on both sides.

A few quotes from some sidecarists over at triumphrat.net:

"...the mounts are such that the hack can be removed in 15 minutes so I can ride solo. I love riding with the hack. My kids love it to. So does the Rottie. I also love riding without the hack. I have the best of both worlds. Dorky and Cool..." -Oregonthruxton

"It does TOTALLY change the way the bike handles... It takes a while to get used to what's "normal" with the hack attached...
It attaches in 30 or so minutes... Takes about 25 to remove." -SCbonneville

"it can be detached in about 15-20 minutes, and reattached in about 20-30 minutes." -TennesseeDon

also:

"Connecting and disconnecting the sidecar is not like hooking a trailer up to your car, so it would not IMO be something that I would be wanting to do for a short jaunt.
If you have the space, I would suggest that you get another bike with sidecar, and have it permanently attached and set up." -Wombat

As I said, both sides.

I realize my ignorance on the subject, and that is why I am here asking for advice.

I'm not trying to sound argumentative here, I'm just trying to explore all the different possibilities so that I can make a more informed decision. If some people had started by telling me that I should use the Bonnie as a part time machine, I'd be questioining that as well. Not to be presumtious, but so that I can learn.

Thank you.

Many when first geting into the sidecar world have the idea of using one bike for the sidecar and also to ride solo. Few end up following through with this plan after taking off and putting on the sidecar a couple of times.
Roger Canfield is one who has done this swapping back and forth on a regualr bais. He runs a 1200 Bandit with a Watsonian GP on it. He also has a car tire conversion for the rear which gets taken off and replaced with a solo rear wheel and tire when he goes that route.
Try swapping back and forth if you wish but history shows that you will probably still end up getting a solo bike or a bike that can be dedicated to the sidecar.

Wolfie, I certainly understand your comments re: using the bike with and without the sidecar. I have several bikes, but I still want to ride my Goldwing without the sidecar and am currently exploring this as a possibility.One of the biggest issues i ran into was whether or not to alter the front forks to reduce the trail on the bike. If you don't, my understanding is the bike may steer pretty hard. (I have never driven a rig with a stock front fork setup, so don't know how difficult). However, where I live, there are lots of mountains and twisties, and I like to ride on them. My 1st rig, a Ural, seemed to steer a little hard in the twisties andI knew I wouldnt want anything that steered harder.My 2nd rig, a V Strom with a Ural, does have reduced trail. It steers a little easier than the UraL. 3rd rig is a Goldwing. also with modified trail. it steers the best, but it still can get tiring in the mountains (its a pretty big rig, so that may be part of it).If you do modify the trail, most will tell you not to ride it solo, handling is pretty screwed up. I rode my Ural solo (The Retro is the only Ural sold as a bike which can be ridden withOUT the sidecar, comes with right side mirrors and turn signals,sidestand, etc). I did not like it. Hard to describe, but felt super wierd turning. Although I sold it, had I kept it, I would never have ridden it solo.So, you can definitely use the bike both with and without, but you may not have the best steering rig (i.e. with the car on). I sure others with much more experience canexplain this better than I, hope it helps.greg

Greg I have the stock Tripple Clamp on my GL1800 and it works just fine with the Hack bolted up. With 4" of trail this is the first Wing I have had starting with the first '75 that was this easy to steer. All of the other Wings and most other touring bikes I have had over the years had 6+" of trail and wern't nearly as easy to set up for 2-Wheel and 3-Wheel use.

Yes I take my sidecar off quite often and maintain three sets of wheels, front and rear, with M/C tires and combinations of Car and Rear tires for the front.

A word of caution when riding without the Sidecar bolted up. Those Mounting Brackets or Sub-Frames that are common may be a hazzard in the corners. I know the Champion front Sub-Frame on mine is way too close and out there for safe Peg-Scraping rides. That Sub-Frame is guaranteed to dig in and flip the bike quicker than the early Kury crash bar mounted pegs were.

Over all it takes me 15 to 20 minutes to simply take of the Hack at home if I use a floor jack to support it. Add another 10 minutes or so if I screw in the Caster Wheels to allow for easy rolling around in the garage to get it out of the way. BTW I have a seperate Brake system for the Sidecar that includes a Brake Lever bolted to the Sidecar frame so the whole thing stays with the bike making it much easier to switch back and forth without the need to bleed the system every 2d or 3d time the Quick-Release is used. While those Quick-Release's are handy they still let air in and take a lot of time bleeding the system when they do. If you have ABS that can be a MAJOR PITA too.

Over the past 35 years with Sidecars on various bikes I have always used them as a Removeable Accessory. The 1800/Escort I have now is the first one that has spent more paired up than seperated even though it is the easiest one I have had to change out. That is a function of having three Cattle Dogs that just have to go with us. If it wern't for them the bike would be in 2-Wheel mode 75% of the time.

One thing that helps me keep from catching the front Sub-Frame in the pavement is the heavy duty springs front and rear plus the spacers up front. That modification puts the bike up quite a ways without the Hack and the 1,400 lb rear spring requires 2 up to moderate the otherwise rough ride. If I wasn't using the rig with 3 dogs and 2 passengers most of the time a 1,200 or 1,300 lb rear spring would be just right.

A friend has his 1800 set up with a 1,300 lb spring for 1 up and 1 in the sidecar and has reported that is just what he needed vs the 1,000/1,200 lb Progressive spring. He also has heavy springs in the front and spacers to get the needed fork travel.

You would need to take some measurements with Hannigan Brackets to determine if you can take a hard right-hander without catching the pavement before getting carried away or you may get carried away. ;-(

I have the Gold Wing 1500 w/Escort and the first two years I dismounted and mounted it (about 15 minutes off and 25 minutes back on) split about half on and half time off. It seemed like every time I had it off for say a week or so, I wished it were back on because my wife and little dog prefer to ride there, so on it would go. I noticed quite hard steering with stock triple trees and two years ago I found a used set of 6 degree rake. What a pleasure to drive with it now! I have run it two years that way but out of curiosity I tried it as a solo with the mods to the fork. I thought I was going to drop it before I got it back to the driveway from down to the end of the block and back. I guess if you never knew the ease of steering with the modified trees you wouldn't miss it. By the way my front mount doesn't stick out so much that it is a danger in the corners except if you got real aggressive. Hope this helps in your decision.
Ralph

Jerry and Ralph, thanks for your comments. David at Hannigan did endeed caution me about cornering too aggressively with the car off.After a long conversation with Claude today i am going to take the sidecar off next week oe so, and try it. Front what I have heard, the reduction in trail on the Wing is not near as significant as on some bikes, and it may handle fine.The point i was trying to make for Wolfie was that from what I understand, some rigs don't steer all that easily with stock forks. The "cure" then makes is potentially difficult to go solo.Before I purchased the Wing i talked to a couple guys who had tried their rigs (GL1900s) with stock forks and eventually got tired of it and reduced the trail.

Greg, if your forks are modified 3 degrees or 4 and a half you might get by riding it as a solo. Truth be known I wish I had the 3 degree myself and then maybe it could be ridden on two wheels. I also have the Progressive springs front and back but don't have the extensions Jerry talks about. I probably need them. I understand what Claude says about too sensitive steering. In a side wind condition mine can get a little jumpy.
Ralph

I have a Valkyrie/Spyder combination. I drove it for a short time with the standard triple tree. The steering was very hard. I changed to a 4.5 degree reduction in the trail and I couldn't believe the difference. I will not ride solo for two reasons. One, my old age bod couldn't handle the 800 lbs of the Valk and two, I won't take a chance on riding a probably dangerous Valkyrie on two wheels. I can ride my sons Valks if I so desire.

Jerry, Hannigan did change the front springs, but the air suspension in back is stock. I guess I never even realized there were springs? Or, have you changed out from the stock to something different? Mine seems great as it, although I havent ridden another one to compare. Also, Connie only weighs 120 or so.Thx for the inputgreg

Originally written by SidehackRalf on 1/21/2008 6:30 PM

I have the Gold Wing 1500 w/Escort and the first two years I dismounted and mounted it (about 15 minutes off and 25 minutes back on) split about half on and half time off. It seemed like every time I had it off for say a week or so, I wished it were back on because my wife and little dog prefer to ride there, so on it would go. I noticed quite hard steering with stock triple trees and two years ago I found a used set of 6 degree rake. What a pleasure to drive with it now! I have run it two years that way but out of curiosity I tried it as a solo with the mods to the fork. I thought I was going to drop it before I got it back to the driveway from down to the end of the block and back. I guess if you never knew the ease of steering with the modified trees you wouldn't miss it. By the way my front mount doesn't stick out so much that it is a danger in the corners except if you got real aggressive. Hope this helps in your decision. Ralph