Originally written by Al Olme Consider adding a pump and going for safer placement. The extra complexity is a good trade off for a safer installation. On a sidecar rig, using the saddle bag between the bike and the car is a reasonable choice. It's lower [better weight distribution] and more protected. If you don't want to give up your saddle bag, a simple tank on the sidecar frame rail is a decent alternative; even lower [lower is better] and also well protected.
Not trying to be argumentative (and Al knows I'm never argumentative...) but to point out some possible problems I've seen with doing it this way;
When you use an electric pump for any type of fuel system you MUST have some sort of switch that will shut of power to the pump AUTOMATICALLY in an accident. Otherwise you have the potential to have fuel spraying under pressure through a now disconnected fuel line. Most cars use an oil pressure switch that shuts off the pump if oil pressure is lost or an inertia switch that shuts off power if bumped hard enough. I've seen VERY FEW even higher end aftermarket aux tanks set up this way.
I am also not comfortable with mounting a fuel tank in such close proximity to a hot (possibly sparking / backfiring) exhaust system.
I used several aftermarket plastic tanks when motocrossing and trail riding back in the 70's. Had some hairy crashes back then but never had a burst tank or gas cap come off. Maybe I was just lucky.
All of which illustrates that no matter which way you go on this issue there are going to be safety trade offs and disagreements on what the greater risk is.
As always standard disclaimers apply, your mileage may vary, see your local dealer for details, etc., etc.,
Originally written by Shadow1100T I got my tank from http://www.coyote-gear.com and I used a small elc. fuel pump sold under the name of Mr. Gasket, the tank comes with metal tie downs.
On the other hand I have used a Coyote tank with the roll over valve installed and they are as solid and clean an installation as you're going to get. They look cool when installed, too. (Never discount the cool factor...)
I didn't realize that this would be such an incendiary thread.
I failed to state that the zip ties were a temporary solution while I developed my ideas on the tank system.
Also, I used the word rupture, not puncture. There is a big difference as the ATV story illustrates.
I think, the bottom line here is that we are all concerned with safety and any input on this topic should be considered.
Originally written by Mark in Idaho
I didn't realize that this would be such an incendiary thread.
I think, the bottom line here is that we are all concerned with safety and any input on this topic should be considered.
"incendiary thread" ya killin' me... ROFLMAO!!!!
Your bottom line is my point exactly though. Anything to do with fuel can be dangerous so, put some real thought into it. I hope that this thread will generate just that. Thanks to everyone who has contributed.
Originally written by Bob Madigan on 8/22/2007 11:31 AM
<BRNot trying to be argumentative (and Al knows I'm never argumentative...) but to point out some possible problems I've seen with doing it this way;When you use an electric pump for any type of fuel system you MUST have some sort of switch that will shut of power to the pump AUTOMATICALLY in an accident. Otherwise you have the potential to have fuel spraying under pressure through a now disconnected fuel line. Most cars use an oil pressure switch that shuts off the pump if oil pressure is lost or an inertia switch that shuts off power if bumped hard enough. I've seen VERY FEW even higher end aftermarket aux tanks set up this way.I am also not comfortable with mounting a fuel tank in such close proximity to a hot (possibly sparking / backfiring) exhaust system. =SNIP=As always standard disclaimers apply, your mileage may vary, see your local dealer for details, etc., etc.,
Bob,I agree with your thinking. Here's mine. If you're uncomfortable mounting a tank so near the "possibly sparking/backfiring exhaust" why would you be more comfortable mounting the tank above the same "possibly sparking/backfiring exhaust"? If gravity still works, I don't see a lot of difference ;^). The thing about the automatic fuel cut off is a good idea. I don't think there is much hazard involved with a pump the way it would be used in the systems I described. Since the pump is used as a "transfer pump" and not a "fuel pump" it would be at risk only while it is turned on. I guess that you could do that while running down the road but it's more likely that you will transfer fuel while stopped. Even if you had the pump on while under way, it would only be on for relatively short periods of time. I like the idea of a fuel pump shutoff though. Maybe if I could run a relay that used the bike's internal fuel pump circuit as the exciter voltage I could piggy back off that fuel shut off. I guess first I need to find out if my bike has such a shut off but the whole idea bears some thought. Thanks for the good ideas. While this thread is going into a little more detail than it might. I believe that some good info has been shared and that's what this site is for.Now, if I could just remember to get this to display without running everything together I'd be doing good.
You could run a wire to the fuel pump wire but any 12v that controlled by the ing. will do and is usually easier to get to, just put a switch in line to the elc fuel pump to shut it off when you go to the main tank. One side benefit of using a Alum. tank is that when it gets really low on fuel it sounds like you have a metal drum next to you, makes it nice for knowing when to shut it off and switch to the main tank.
Al, select "disable HTML in this post" to stop the run on.
Like I said earlier I tend to over engineer things and plan for the worst case scenario. Ok, I'm picturing the pump powered on in a wreck sufficient to possibly separate the driver from the rig, the chair from the tug, and the aux tank from the whole thing. You know, real ugly.
And I would say that getting rear ended is a remote possibility if I hadn't been hit on a bike that way three time in my life. Once in broad daylight stopped at a red light, all 6'4", 275# of me on a Panhead chopper with a 4' sissybar and ape hangers. Poor old woman had never, ever seen a motorcyclist in her entire 81 years on the planet! Demanded that the responding officer arrest me for scaring her like that! So, you're right, it's not out of the question.
It goes back to evaluating your own risk. Am I more at risk to be rear ended if I mount an aux tank up on the luggage rack or to have a hose get pulled off in a wreck with a pump pressurized? Do I want a semi-permanent tank or do I build it to be easily removable and installed only for longer trips? How does my projected use affect my risk factors? I was comfortable with my modified boat tank that I used only on longer trips driving the rig by myself. I wouldn't have been as comfortable hauling my kids in the chair with that setup running the backroads or in town. But I was comfortable under any circumstance with a Goldwing 1100 solo bike that I removed the tourbox from and replaced it with a racing fuel cell with roll over venting and solid, permanent mounting. It was classy looking, safe, and had a degree of impact resistance. It also cost a good deal more than my boat tank setup did.
You're right about the exhaust though. I've just burned myself on them so many times that I have an unnatural aversion to letting anything get too close to hot pipes now 😉
Sorry I've run on so much but I am enjoying this thread. I'm likely to get fired if anyone realizes that the tech drawings on my desk are actually sketches of auxilary fuel tanks, pumps, and mounts ideas.
