Hi all!
Saw this on another forum and wanted to link it up here as well. For those who pull trailers or know people that do there's some valuable and even life-saving info there! Tom Finch the author of the post giving technical advice is an acknowledged expert in the field.
As always, RIDE SAFE!
http://gl1800riders.com/forums/showthread.php?342873-Hitch-Issue
Never new the first 4 years of the new gold wing had so meany frame problems.
Rode an 05 GL 1800 for over 50,000 miles over a four year period. Frame issues had been taken care of by the time I bought mine. Never dragged a trailer but will admit to having ridden it many miles like a sports bike. Dragging foot pegs regularly and occasionally becoming air borne on abrupt Up/down rises on mountain roads. This was a solo bike, not a sidecar rig. I would never hesitate to buy another Wing (though I doubt I will as I love my Beemer with EZS sidecar). I absolutely believe that if properly mounted the Wing can definitely drag a trailer, and a sidecar, too.
Yeah, I'm sure the main message there was about trailer tongue height, angle and loads in trailer etc. and not about the GW frame. I never knew that about the trailer tongue and most likely would have set one up all wrong. As he shows, that can be fatal!
I have always considered a trailer behind a two wheel machine, a jack knife crash
waiting to happen. I don't even like following one.
A heavy sidecar machine is a whole different animal and properly set up may be a lot safer.
Phelonius - 3/18/2013 1:28 AM
I have always considered a trailer behind a two wheel machine, a jack knife crash
waiting to happen. I don't even like following one.
A heavy sidecar machine is a whole different animal and properly set up may be a lot safer.
Agreed! Even worse, such a 2 wheeler rig with no trailer brake! As your bike flops over and you wonder what that was that just passed you, that looked familiar? Yeah it should, it was your trailer....
Harley has never indorsed pulling a trailer. If you had a bike under warranty and they see a trailer hitch on it they void your warranty.
XLerate - 3/18/2013 2:16 AM
Yeah, I'm sure the main message there was about trailer tongue height, angle and loads in trailer etc. and not about the GW frame. I never knew that about the trailer tongue and most likely would have set one up all wrong. As he shows, that can be fatal!
They show a two pictures of broke gold wing frames in the link for some reason! Though it would be a good idea so those that own them and that year can keep an eye on it. I do all I can to help people keep from getting hurt. Sorry if I hurt your feelings. I just never new about the 01-04 frames and was surprised.
46u - 3/18/2013 9:13 AM
Harley has never indorsed pulling a trailer. If you had a bike under warranty and they see a trailer hitch on it they void your warranty.
I picked up my current bike, a 1996 FLH Ultra in October of '95. Had the hitch mounted when the bike arrived at the dealer. I've got over 114,000 or 116,000 on the clock now (don't recall which and I'm not out where it is right now). I had the extended warranty as well as the original one. I never once had any dealer or H-D itself question the hitch or what I towed when I had warranty work done. And that happened a few times during the warranty period. And of the 100,000 plus miles on the bike, probably 50% were towing. Mostly my Kwik Kamp tent trailer that I sold as part of buying the Liberty sidecar for the bike. The rest with my smaller cargo trailer.
--I had the sidecar put on at about 85,000.--
Reardan Tom - 3/18/2013 3:08 PM
46u - 3/18/2013 9:13 AM
Harley has never indorsed pulling a trailer. If you had a bike under warranty and they see a trailer hitch on it they void your warranty.
I picked up my current bike, a 1996 FLH Ultra in October of '95. Had the hitch mounted when the bike arrived at the dealer. I've got over 114,000 or 116,000 on the clock now (don't recall which and I'm not out where it is right now). I had the extended warranty as well as the original one. I never once had any dealer or H-D itself question the hitch or what I towed when I had warranty work done. And that happened a few times during the warranty period. And of the 100,000 plus miles on the bike, probably 50% were towing. Mostly my Kwik Kamp tent trailer that I sold as part of buying the Liberty sidecar for the bike. The rest with my smaller cargo trailer.
--I had the sidecar put on at about 85,000.--
All I can go by is others that their warranty was revoked by Harley for having a trailer hitch and I know them personalty. All those I know had much newer bikes so I do not know if this might be something new.
One of my friends that it happen to a HD rep came by to look at the problem the bike was having and the HD dealer was having problems find what was wrong and the minuet the rep saw the trailer hitch the canceled the warranty.
I know for fact Harley has never indorsed and even said other wise about pulling a trailer.
Nice to see a bike with some mileage. My 02 ultra I bought new only has 92K on it. I do just about all my own work to mine as I do not trust others. The few times I let a Harley dealer ship work on mine because of being on the rode they messed something up. I all so had two recalls on it first one was fine the second one I took it home and fixed what they messed they did my self.
Glade they never pulled your warranty over your hitch.
46u - 3/18/2013 9:26 AM
XLerate - 3/18/2013 2:16 AM
Yeah, I'm sure the main message there was about trailer tongue height, angle and loads in trailer etc. and not about the GW frame. I never knew that about the trailer tongue and most likely would have set one up all wrong. As he shows, that can be fatal!
They show a two pictures of broke gold wing frames in the link for some reason! Though it would be a good idea so those that own them and that year can keep an eye on it. I do all I can to help people keep from getting hurt. Sorry if I hurt your feelings. I just never new about the 01-04 frames and was surprised.
Yes he does show that for a reason. But do notice that the thread and his posts are on a Honda Forum, so he's not out to trash Hondas. I think he added that in as "Oh, by the way, speaking of frames..." and to show the specific damge that might occur on the member's Honda bikes and what to inspect for. That is, if they didn't get themselves killed first with a bogus hitch setup.
I don't know how the Harley frames are, but I do know I had to weld up the instrument panel/speedo mounting bracket on a '92 FLHST I rewired the other day. Had never been dropped by the owner [a friend of mine] who bought it new. Cracked clean through. Seems if it hadn't been dropped it must have been a stress fracture in the steel. Not really surprised myself because I think that whole bracket and mounting assembly is poorly engineered. No flames, just a two-bit opinion here...
XLerate - 3/19/2013 12:49 AM
46u - 3/18/2013 9:26 AM
XLerate - 3/18/2013 2:16 AM
Yeah, I'm sure the main message there was about trailer tongue height, angle and loads in trailer etc. and not about the GW frame. I never knew that about the trailer tongue and most likely would have set one up all wrong. As he shows, that can be fatal!
They show a two pictures of broke gold wing frames in the link for some reason! Though it would be a good idea so those that own them and that year can keep an eye on it. I do all I can to help people keep from getting hurt. Sorry if I hurt your feelings. I just never new about the 01-04 frames and was surprised.
Yes he does show that for a reason. But do notice that the thread and his posts are on a Honda Forum, so he's not out to trash Hondas. I think he added that in as "Oh, by the way, speaking of frames..." and to show the specific damge that might occur on the member's Honda bikes and what to inspect for. That is, if they didn't get themselves killed first with a bogus hitch setup.
I don't know how the Harley frames are, but I do know I had to weld up the instrument panel/speedo mounting bracket on a '92 FLHST I rewired the other day. Had never been dropped by the owner [a friend of mine] who bought it new. Cracked clean through. Seems if it hadn't been dropped it must have been a stress fracture in the steel. Not really surprised myself because I think that whole bracket and mounting assembly is poorly engineered. No flames, just a two-bit opinion here...
Not near the danger of a instrument mount breaking as a frame. The only frames I know off that Harley had problems with where on the early big twin swing are frame on the drive side and is why the later ones had a gossip welded there that fixed this problem. I feel any time you can give any one a heads up for them to keep an eye on is a good thing no matter what brand!
"Not near the danger of a instrument mount breaking as a frame. The only frames I know off that Harley had problems with where on the early big twin swing are frame on the drive side and is why the later ones had a gossip welded there that fixed this problem. I feel any time you can give any one a heads up for them to keep an eye on is a good thing no matter what brand!"
This wasn't intended as a Honda bashing or Harley bashing thread at all: just an alert to those who pull trailers to inspect their hitch angle and height etc. Every mechanical device and everything on earth has flaws, goes with the territory as we live in an imperfect world. One day that will change for some of us...
RE: the instrument panel bracket. This thread is about poor engineering and design. I didn't intend to pound on Harley but now I'll give my views on it even if it's offensive to Harley owners or diehards. No it's not such a big deal I suppose. But focusing on it, Harley should have enough experience building cruisers with speedometers and instrument panels by now to get it right the first time after 100+ years.
That whole area of the bike was a nightmare of poor engineering and guaranteed user unfriendliness also making it very hard to even closely inspect those components. The wiring loom was too short by about 3"-4" and drawn so tight it might even cause disconnects, also intentionally and knowingly making wiring access extremely difficult.
The flexible rubber mounting strap for relays was just too weird, encouraging wire flexing which is bad for copper wire and connectors. Relay studs had cheap plastic acorn nuts screwed on top of fastener metal nuts to prevent shorts which could be caused by the strange rubber strip's flexible mounting. These plastic nuts gunk up the screw threads upon removal and are then not reuseable and/or are then easy to cross thread.
The other screw fasteners really sucked, not actually fitting high quality #1 or #2 Philips or straight blade drivers either, tried over a dozen drivers for different screws.
The design has an apparent pre-load on the bracket encouraging stress failure on what should be a non-stressed part, which could be unstressed and free standing.
The access is extremely difficult by design so there's a very good chance of losing fasteners, damaging wiring, messing up connections etc.
The wiring colors were too similar in a couple of circuits when they didn't have to be, which encourages incorrect wiring. There's lots more colors available out there, more vivid contrasts, instead of mixing light gray/blue with light gray with light grayish tan with light brown at one switch. It's also very difficult to find accurate, well written and well drawn wiring diagrams for these or other Harleys.
We all know it's the details that make for a good design and in my narrow opinion Harley completely blew it on design of this area of this bike. Far more suffering than it had to be and to me, inexcusable. Sorry if that offends anybody but again, I didn't design it that way, Harley did.
Reardan Tom - 3/18/2013 11:08 AM
46u - 3/18/2013 9:13 AM
Harley has never indorsed pulling a trailer. If you had a bike under warranty and they see a trailer hitch on it they void your warranty.
I picked up my current bike, a 1996 FLH Ultra in October of '95. Had the hitch mounted when the bike arrived at the dealer. I've got over 114,000 or 116,000 on the clock now (don't recall which and I'm not out where it is right now). I had the extended warranty as well as the original one. I never once had any dealer or H-D itself question the hitch or what I towed when I had warranty work done. And that happened a few times during the warranty period. And of the 100,000 plus miles on the bike, probably 50% were towing. Mostly my Kwik Kamp tent trailer that I sold as part of buying the Liberty sidecar for the bike. The rest with my smaller cargo trailer.
--I had the sidecar put on at about 85,000.--
Gotta say, that's one GREAT LOOKING RIG Tom! Maybe I'm not green with envy but I'm not rosy red either... NICE!
I have not only been riding Harley s among other bikes mostly old British bikes but always had a Harley for over 42 years none stop. If you count before I had a Harley been riding for 44 years. My fist two bikes I had where Honda s and both good bikes. Being I have been working on them just about as long I know many of the short comings on Harley s and many other bikes. I have 3 Harley motors I am building right now and I do 90% or more of all the work including but not limited to the machine work.
I am a Harley person but ride with many others that ride other brands. I do no care what a person rides as long as they ride and not sit around talking about riding. I like all bikes no matter what brand. I am in the Georgia Sidecar Club and there are many in the club that ride other brands. I have always said the motorcycle does not make the man the man makes the motorcycle.
I know many Harley owners that all they do is ride to the bar drink and talk about riding then ride home. These types are not a motorcycle enthusiast just a owner. I rather ride then go to the bar. LOL All the metric brands for the most part make good motorcycles like most of the top brands.
I am waiting on a customer to pick up his Suzuki I just got done working on right now.
