Sidecar Info Please

I'll give it a try. First I'm a newcomer so these are my impressions which might be different from the veteran sidecarists here. I'm 79 and my son and I installed the car, never did it before but had a lot of verbal help.
I have a Valk/Spyder rig. Since the Valk is a heavy bike with the GW motor it would be similiar in some ways.
Do your homework! Read up on sidecars, ask questions. read some more, ask more questions. Riding with a sidecar is entirely different than two wheels! There is no comparison. You turn with a car, when you accel the rig pull right, when you decel, the rig pulls left You can lift the car in right turns, you can high side in left turns. The rig will probably steer hard unless you reduce the trail. If you reduce the trail, the bike could be dangerous to ride on two wheels.
When I first drove around the block I thought "You've ruined a perfectly good motorcycle."
Now comes the question? Would I do it again, the answer, yes! It's different but more enjoyable, it takes the load off my 79 year old knees.
It attracts more attention, unlike trikes. I had a gentleman wave at me first the other day. He was driving a convertible Duesenberg, a very classic car. He knew uniqueness.
COSTS. It would probably run about $6,000 to 10,000 if you buy new, have it installed and painted, IMHO.
SUMMARY. My advice is to get all the info that you can on sidecars. It will be a new and entirely different experience for you and your wife and should not be undertaken lightly. You've taken the first step by asking here where there are many sidecarists more experienced than I. Once again, in my opinion, do not think that you will be able to take the car off and ride two wheels at random. If the job is done the whole way, the GW will be dedicated to three wheels and not easily changed back.

Wayne

Hi Rick - You're off to a great start - prospecting for informatio here at sidecar.com. Consider also scooting up to Americade on June 8 if you can and hooking up with Bruce Stephens "8th Annual informal gathering of sidecars" at the Adirondack Camping Village (www.adirondackcampingvillage.com) and check out all the different rigs that will be there and talk to the folks who pilot them.

More events can be found here:
http://www.sidecar.com/megabbs/thread-view.asp?threadid=4437

A motorcycle with a sidecar attached is no longer a motorcycle! It steers like a car (turn left to go left) rather than a motorcycle.

You can spend a bunch of money on acquiring, setting up and painting a rig - if you want to. You'll figure that one out as you do your research.

Drawbacks: You are always leading the parade! Folks will want to talk to you when you stop about your rig and you'll get lots of smiles. Oh yeah - getting the rig set up properly is a must as handling can be awful if it isn't. You're adding a lot of mass on the right side, so while accelerating the bike will tend to want to go right and left when slowing down. Setup can minimize this effect. Turning, both left and right can get interesting if you are not ready for what is coming. Training and reading and talking to folks and practicing a lot will help.

Personally, trikes leave me cold. I find them boring to drive. Sidecars were always attractive to me for some reason. I just knew I was going to have one some day.

Passengers experience depends on the passenger and on the sidecar and the setup. It can be comfortable and quiet or not. My wife prefers to ride behind me, when she rides. My daughter (17) is quite happy in the car.

I did not install my sidecar myself though many do. I'm in the "it costs me more if I help" group of people.

Sidecars can be set up to be detached, but in many cases this turns out to be a feature that is less exercised over time. Refer back to the differences in handling and it can be wierd to use the same bike solo and with a car attached.

I have an EZS Summit sidecar attached to my R1100RT BMW. The same Summit also attaches to the GoldWing. A rudimentary look at my choice here: http://home.comcast.net/~stevewoo/

Links to manufactures, dealers, components and installers right here at sidecar.com: http://www.sidecar.com/stuff.asp

Links to self paced training also right here at sidecar.com: http://www.sidecar.com/links3.asp

More local info for you: http://www.sidecar.com/Maps/connecticut.htm and http://www.sidecar.com/Maps/new_york.htm

Good luck and enjoy the process!

Rick,

I too got into sidecars because of a bad leg but gave up motorcycles for 30 plus years 1st boy did I miss a lot of fun. I am happy that you have a wife that is smarter than I was. I will try to give you my thought on your questions one at a time and I know there will be others to follow.

1. What are your general impressions concerning the handling of the bike with the sidecar?

A. sidecar rigs are a world of their own. You ride a bike and you drive a sidecar rig. This is not good or bad just different.

2. What should I expect to spend to have a sidecar installed and painted to match my 2004 bright red Goldwing?

A. boy is this an open one. You can pick up a used sidecar for very little do the work yourself and go up from there. I will post some links at the bottom for you to do some looking.

3. Are there any major drawbacks to the sidecar?

A. there too much fun I live in Fla so ride just about every day and that is not enough. They take a whole parking space. Maybe some one can do better on this one than I can I love my rig.

4. Did you consider triking your bike and if so, why did you decide a sidecar was the way to go?

A. yes I started out looking at trikes. I when with a sidecar for a number of reasons one was the people on this site was just too nice. Also I did not know if I was going to like it and thought I could get out for lest money. The sidecar could also take the things I wanted with me on my rides my dog for one.

5. What does the sidecar passenger have to say about the experience of riding in a sidecar?

A. I will leave this one to someone that can do better with it but my fat dog love it.

6. Did you install the sidecar yourself?

A. no but I have done it since and I think I could have. There are a lot of people here that will help.

7. Is the sidecar detachable? If so, what is left on the motorcycle when the sidecar is detached?

A. Yes it is but why is the thing with me today. But it was a part of my thinking at the start that if I did not like riding any more I could pull the car and sale the bike.

8. What make and model did you choose?

A. I have a Honda shadow 1100 with a Velorex 565.

9. Links to manufacturers.

A. you will find a lot of good info from the home page here,
This is the ling to manufactures.
http://www.sidecar.com/stuff.asp

Two good magazines to read about the 1st are the “Sidecarest” that you get when you join USCA.

http://www.sidecar.com/membership.asp

the next is in their word, that a good ones, “Hack’d, The Magazine For and About Sidecarists, is just that!”
http://www.hackd.com/index.html

I hope I have been of some help.

solo1 - thanks for the valuable feedback. Yes, the Valkyrie and Goldwing share a lot. I'm glad you affirm my doing careful research. I'm going to look carefully into the handling aspects.

stevewoo - I've ridden by Adirondack Camping Village many times. My vacation home in Speculator, NY is only an hour west of Lake George and I've ridden extensively around Lake George. I go to Americade about every other year but I can't recall seeing any sidecar vendors. Lots of trike vendors. Assuming I'm mobile by this June (which I should be) I'll drive over to Adirondack Camping Village and talk to the sidecarists there (prior to registering on this site, I didn't know "sidecarists" was the term you folks use).

RichardMc4 - Thanks for taking the time to answer my questions. I'll take a look at the Velorex. I'm getting the idea that there are quite a few manufacturers of sidecars.

Thank you also for all the links. I see that many of these links are to postings, etc. right on this site. Any other info you think would be helpful would be appreciated. I think I'll be busy today checking out the links and info.

Sidecar vs. Trike

Consider taking a S/TEP class before you make up your mind. Choose a class that provides both sidecars and trikes to learn on. Ride them both and get a firsthand impression of which you prefer, before spending a bucket of money to buy one. Right now, as far as I know, the Evergreen program in Seattle is the only place where they provide both trike and sidecar training rigs. I am building a trike for the Adventure Sidecar S/TEP program but I am not sure when it will be ready. I am hoping to be able to use it in classes by July of this year but it isn't there yet. You can check my website to see when it is ready; I am putting the trike project photos up here:

http://adventuresidecar.com/Piglet/piglet.htm

If you are going to pay someone to put together a sidecar, color matched and of appropriate quality to your Goldwing, you will probably spend about the same amount for either; it will be more than you expect and certainly not less than 6-7 thousand, probably more.

For the money you can get much more in a sidecar than a trike. You spend a big chunk of trike conversion costs on the drive train and wheels.

Trikes are symmetrical and some people find them easier to learn to drive.
According to David Hough and the material we use to teach the S/TEP class, aside from using the same cornering techniques turning trikes left and right, you need exactly the same skill set and use all the same skills handling a trike as you do a sidecar.
According to much of what you see on the trike forums, you don't need to know anything special to handle a trike and it will rip through the corners as fast as a solo bike with no stability issues.**** I suspect that neither position is a very good reflection of the reality-I know you can flip a trike or lift a wheel in a corner, I have seen it done. I also know that many of the modern trike conversions are indeed fast, stable machines and easy to learn to handle. I still think the S/TEP program is a good idea for someone starting out on a trike or a sidecar.

If you don't like the sidecar you can take it off and have your old motorcycle back. Usually the trike conversion is a permanent thing. The Voyager type conversions are an exception, but since you end up with 4 wheels on the ground they aren't really trikes (and are technically illegal in most jurisdictions, being by definition automobiles yet not meeting automobile safety or DOT standards).

On the other hand, trikes seem to command very high resale prices, whereas it can sometimes be difficult to sell even a very nice used sidecar rig for anything close to what it cost to put together. Go figure...

The sidecar community seems to be much better organized and supported than the trike community. The trike community is divided between the motorcycle conversions and the car based trikes, with the car based trikes having a much bigger online presence than the motorcycle conversions. Even combined, I haven't found nearly the activity and support for trikes that I find for sidecars. Not sure why.

My personal bias is in favor of sidecars over trikes. You do need to learn to handle them, but once you get that figured out you can drive them in a spirited manner or putz along enjoying the scenery with the added security of that third wheel holding you up. The passenger accommodation's are usually much better with a sidecar as is the load carrying capacity and ease of packing. Sidecars seem to me to be much more convenient and comfortable than trikes. But , like everything to do with motorcycles, that is an extremely subjective and personal preference- Get what makes you smile and causes you to sneak out to the garage to look at it one more time before turning out the lights!

Hi Rums54:
You have already received some very excellent advice, so I will only add the following.
I have a vtx1300/velorex. I have been running this combo for 6 years. I love my rig, but if I were going to replace it (the sidecar) these are some things I would require. Ease of access for both passenger and luggage. (Flip open front) Wider hip room, = a roomier interior, and passenger comfort. A locking truck with access from the outside, and overhead and side protection from inclement weather. I recommend that your passenger be allowed a "sit in" test before you make your final decision. There are many who would recommend that a Goldwing run something heavier than a Velorex.

People love sidecars. You are going to have so much fun, you'll never want to go back to 2 wheels.

Good luck in your search, and safe riding,
gp

Be warned, it'll take longer to get where you're going than on 2 or 4 wheels. You will find your self looking for the long twisty ways instead of the short cuts (I love dirt roads)and wherever you go, people want to stop you and ask all manner of questions. You can plan on taking 10%longer just from talking.

Originally written by Mark in Idaho on 4/28/2007 1:05 PM

Be warned, it'll take longer to get where you're going than on 2 or 4 wheels. You will find your self looking for the long twisty ways instead of the short cuts (I love dirt roads)and wherever you go, people want to stop you and ask all manner of questions. You can plan on taking 10%longer just from talking.

Heck, what you described is half the fun of a sidecar.

By the way, the GL 1800 and GL 1500 before it are two very fine motorcycles for pulling a sidecar. Lots and lots of power and low end torque.

Good luck!

I have a Goldwing with a sidecar, a Hannigan GTL. I find the Wing to be a very nice tug, the charateristics which make it so nice as a tourer, carryover to sidecaring, It has tremendous power, reverse, low maintenance, hordes of accesories, etc.

We got into sidecaring due to Connie's health, but now love it for its own sake. We are going to Alsaka from LA this summer.

I think you would be very happy with a rig based on the Wing.

greg

Originally written by gregbenner on 5/9/2007 2:19 AM

I have a Goldwing with a sidecar, a Hannigan GTL. I find the Wing to be a very nice tug, the charateristics which make it so nice as a tourer, carryover to sidecaring, It has tremendous power, reverse, low maintenance, hordes of accesories, etc.

We got into sidecaring due to Connie's health, but now love it for its own sake. We are going to Alsaka from LA this summer.

I think you would be very happy with a rig based on the Wing.

greg

Yes, I personally think the big Hondas would be probably the best for a sidecar. They have lots of cubic inches and six cylinders which help with the low speed torque. They have lots of hig speed power, too.

The only thing you really need to do on a Goldwing would be to remove the rear drive every time you change a rear tire and lube the drive shaft with the special Honda Moly lube. Those drive shafts are the only part of a Goldwing that you need to worry about. The rest of the bike is practically bulletproof. I had a 1994 SE 1500 for 7 years and liked it very much although I got to where I couldn't hold it up anymore as a solo. A sidecar would be much better for me.

Happy Trails!