Recreational flying....and the law

A friend in law enforcement calls it "Imprudent driving" and says it carries the same penalties as squealling tires and popping wheels in traffic. He says that even if you know it's safe, it doesn't take into account the reaction of other motorists. Here in Wisconsin it's worth 6 points off your driver's license. That equates to about a $150 fine.
I've yet to see someone fined for it though.

That's an interesting question. I've never seen anyone actually fly a sidecar (at least, not on purpose). I did have a border crossing guard, attendant or whatever the heck they're called, call my sidecar a contraption. Which, by the way, really got my Irish up. But, I can't imagine that too many police officers would find it amusing if you were flying a car in traffic. But, since you brought up that legal issue, I always wondered if, since the sidecar has a seat belt, a passenger in the sidecar is required to wear a helmet in states that have helmet laws. Anybody know?
Connie

Hey Mike;

"Imprudent driving" huh? And the response of other motorists? Well Sir, I can testify that the response of other motorists could be dangerous....for flying the car does capture their attention to a high degree. And when their attention is on you and the outfit, it isn't on other traffic. So I can see that....

And inasmuch as one is very much hindered in life, by way of work, social activity, even going to the grocery store and so forth by the lack of a driving license, I certainly wouldn't want to lose mine with unlawful driving. I've always considered driving without insurance, or a license, to be right along up there with playing with dynamite for smarts.

So, I guess I'll do my flying in private....takes a lot of the enjoyment out of it of course.

Later!

Sahagan

Hi Connie;

A 'contraption'? I guess if he'd seen you fly the car, it would have been 'flying the contraption', and I'll bet his local and state traffic laws don't even address 'flying the contraption'. As for my part and in my opinion, the sidecar is the ultimate motorcycle accessory. It is an add-on, that something extra that gives added comfort, utility, safety, interest and even excitement. There seem to be very few things to which you can add so much extra so easily. Can you think of an automobile add-on accessory equilivent to the sidecar? I can't....unless its a camper trailer, or a boat, but shucks, those are just trailers, not integral parts of the set-up as a whole.

As to flying the car, haven't you done that? Simply take a right hand turn with a little added speed, or sharpen your curve slightly, and the car will come up of its own accord. Of course, the problem occurs when you fly the car without sufficient room to get it back down without running off the road. Some practice though, and you quickly enough learn the limits within which you must stay.

On the other hand, it is kind of complicated, for everything changes depending upon speed, ballast and so forth....so care certainly is indicated.

As of yet, I've never flown my car with the wife on-board. There are a couple of reasons for that, uppermost being her objection to such activity. Secondarily is the fact that with her weight combined with that of the hack, I would have to make so much speed, and make such a severe right hand turn, that it appears to me only an emergency situation would call for that kind of manuever. And I do my utmost to stay out of emergency situations when on a bike, sidecar or not....

However, my 8 year old grand-daughter dotes on my flying the car with her aboard (ummm....seems we've forgotten to mention that to her grandmother). And with her lesser weight, its a cinch. When doing so, her giggle is testimony to the fun she's having. Sort of like a ride at the fair I suppose.

Another thing I've noticed is the number of kids you meet who do want to ride the sidecar. Never had one begging to be placed upon the passenger pillion of the solo bike....but have ridden several around restaurant parking lots and suchlike. Their parents are always thrilled to have you do so. And no, I make a point NOT to fly the car at those times!

Have a good one and we'll catch you later....

Sahagan

Connie,
Since sidecars are deemed an accessory, all states I've driven in still classify the monkey as a motorcycle passenger and as such need to follow the motorcycle statutes. The only variance seems to be regarding underage sidecar passengers. In Washington state a passenger under 5 years of age is not allowed on the public roads if actually on the motorcycle. There is no such stipulation for passengers within a sidecar since there is no risk of falling off, however they must wear a helmet.

Lonnie

By the way, as to flying the chair, a good way to check the lift point on the sidecar is to find an empty space, parking lot, level field, etc, large enough that you can drive clockwise in about a 60' circle at low speed. Do not change the throttle setting or jerk the bars to try to lift the car. All you have to do is keep making the circle smaller at the same speed until the car becomes weightless and starts to lift. A little smaller circle and you will be flying the chair without any sudden movements that might prove alarming. To drop the car down, ease up on the throttle, pull in the clutch, or straighten out the bars. When you have the chair in the air you just have a lopsided 2 wheel motorcycle and it can be controlled by countersteering like any other 2 wheeler This is called reversionary steering. It's not complicated, single track vehicles turn by countersteering (push left turn right and vice versa) and 2 track vehicles steer by turning in the direction you want to go (push left turn left).

By the way, how is that voyager working out? How's the ride?

Lonnie

Hi Lonnie;

With your permission I'd like to say this....your simple explanation of 'reversionary' steering is the best I've seen to date. Maybe its the best, because it IS simple and easily understood.

Have a good one!

Sahagan

Lonnie,

The biggest problem I find with doing any practicing is finding a lot where the owners will allow you to do it. Even the community college where I took the beginning motorcycle class wouldn't allow anyone to practice on their lot. But, maybe someday I'll try it the way you advised. I have had the car in the air (once), I definitely didn't care for it and try to always drive so that there are no repeat performances! I'm not interested in doing anything fancy, anyway, just in going safely down the road. And as far as helmets go, I always make, whomever rides in the sidecar, wear one. If I have to wear one they have to wear one, too. I guess, I was mostly just curious about that. However, on the rare occasion that I can get my husband to drive and let me ride in the sidecar, I might go without a helmet (if it's legal).
Now about the Voyager, I still am not in love with it. But, I hate to give up my toys once I have them! The ride is definitely better with the sidecar. The Voyager bounces "a lot"!!!! And if the road surface is bad and speed high (interstate speed), it can make the bike kind of flop side to side (really scary the first time that happened). But, gas mileage is better with the Voyager and it's not nearly so adversely affected by the wind as the sidecar (which is probably the biggest drawback of a sidecar, as far as I'm concerned). Of course, you lose all of that space for hauling things, and the thing I miss most is that I don't have the sidecar mounts to rest my right foot on. So far, and maybe it's only my ineptitude, but I really don't find it any easier to take tight turns with the Voyager. Of course, I have had 8 years of practice with the sidecar, so that might not be a fair comparison, but I was really hoping that it would be much easier. But, I'm not quite ready to give up on the Voyager just yet.

Connie

Hi Shagan,
If I hadn't wanted back into the country so badly, I would have had a few choice words for that jerk guard that called my baby a contraption. But, I really seriously doubt that I would enjoy "flying" my sidecar. However, I have no doubt that your granddaughter would love flying in yours. Kids are drawn to sidecars like bees to honey. One of my favorite things is riding in the Christmas parade and watching the kids' reactions to the sidecar.
Oh, yeah, I get a lot of grief from my two wheel friends, but most of them, at one time or another, have found reason to ask me to haul something for them or wanted to put their helmets in the car to keep them out of the rain or the sun. And occasionally, I wind up hauling someones wife somewhere because the husband wanted to go somewhere that she didn't. And besides that, the sidecar is great to go shopping with. I definitely think sidecars are great, but I really don't suggest you fly the car with your wife, unless, she is fully aware of your intentions!!!!
Well, fly close to the ground!!!
"Talk" to ya later!
Connie

Hey, Lonnie

By the way, I was wondering have you ever driven a bike mounted on a Voyager??? And if you have, what you thought of it?

Connie

All I can think about while reading these posts is my 4yr old daughter yelling "higher Daddy, higher!!!" While this is always done in a controlled situation, I've found it very educational for those "white knuckle" experiences that occur from time to time. The most noteable being the time a dog ran at me and I was able to fly the chair over it. The guy behind me in the car pulled alongside me after I stopped and said he never saw anything like that before. I told him I hoped to never see that again! But it was purely insinct, no thought involved. So I guess my point is that practicing to do it can be beneficial when the time comes.

Connie,
The closest I came was when a Voyager customer who had just bought one came and wanted to trade it in on a sidecar for his bike. However I declined his offer. He did return later and get a sidecar though.

Lonnie

Scottas,
Sounds like all that practice really did pay off for you. I've never hit anything with my sidecar, but I did kill a deer with my motorcycle while it was attached to the sidecar. It happened so fast that I didn't even have time to hit the brakes. I just remember thinking it was going to hurt "bad" when I flew over the handlebars!!!! Luckily, I didn't!!!
My kids are grown and if they want to fly in a sidecar, they'll have to buy their own. Actually, that brings me to a point that I wanted to make to Lonnie about the Voyager.
Well, watch out for dogs and deer, they can sure mess up your plans (and your bike)! I hope you and your daughter will always have fun together!
Connie

Lonnie,

This is the point that I mentioned in my reply to Scottas post. From everything that I've been able to learn about Voyagers, feelings about them are similar to feelings about sidecars. Some people love them and some people hate them. My husband doesn't "hate" either one, but he wouldn't dream of driving either unless it was to please me (something he's rarely interested in doing). My son, who has ridden motorcycles as long as he has driven cars, absolutely hates my sidecar. Everyone that I have allowed to drive my rig definitely never wanted to drive it the second time. I had one friend that drove it a few feet and got off. He wouldn't even bring it back to where I had it parked. And I would never have gotten in the seat the second time if my husband hadn't already bought the thing for me. I hated it so badly and was so afraid of it that I can't even begin to describe how desperately I regretted the words, "Honey, buy that for me, I can't turn it over." But, I sucked it up, faced my fear of and hate for the beast and set about conquering it. My son used to watch me sit on it and try to summon the courage to go down the driveway and he would say, "Mom, you're gonna kill yourself." And I would say, "Your father wants me to ride it and I'm gonna!" Now, I really love the silly thing, but I would never have gotten to that point if I hadn't felt compelled to ride it.
Don't know if I'll ever "love" the Voyager, but I want to give it a fair chance.

Connie

Knowing the intricacies (sp?) of the cop mind, one of the first things I did was put my copy of "The Yellow Book" in the map pocket of my Ural's car. That way I could show the bonehead that was giving me a hard time that flying the car is an integral part of the approved training process, just like spinning his cruiser out on the skidpan was an integral part of the defensive driving training he is given.

"Sarge" comes, not from military service but, rather, 23 years as a cop. Like in any group of people, there are "peaches" and "lemons" wearing blue. I've worked with both. And I now can look back and realize that, at times (especially as a new officer), I was a "lemon" myself. That's how one learns to deal with them!

Sarge