Quote from Hack__n on August 25, 2007, 11:06 am

Mark,
You're preaching to the Choir here. Many are unhappy at how this legislation turned out.
Since you are so inflamed regarding this issue, why not become an activist as apposed to a whiner. This may bring about some changes in the rules.
You say you have a Yahoo group. Why not get a movement going going that will try to make some changes in the law instead of the constant sniveling?

Lonnie
Northwest Sidecars

Quote from Guest on August 25, 2007, 4:47 pm

I already contacted the head of the program at DOL, all three
of my representatives, the governor and Tim Eyman.

I have also posted the entire fiasco that I have been through
on every motorcycle related forum I frequent.

I passed the test. It is done for me, but I will continue to try
to get the 3-wheel endorsement requiremnt eliminated.

The test is an absolute farce.
I was told that I would be timed for each exercise.
I asked what the time limits were.

THEY SAID THEY CANNOT TELL THE TEST SUBJECTS WHAT THE
CRITERION IS THAT THEY ARE BEING JUDGED BY!!.

They would not tell me how long I had.

They would not tell me how long I had to do it in.
I did see that on the first exercise (cone slalom, then
a u-turn between to lines, and end with front wheel inside
the box you started from) I missed the time criterion by
1/2 second and I lost 10 points. Actually, 30.00 or less is
no deduction, 30.01 to 34.99 sec. = 5 points deducted and
35.00 seconds or more = 10 points deducted.
My time was 35.59 seconds.

Sotaking your time & being careful (conservative riding) will
cause a loss of points. I did maintain the required 10 mph
through the course, but I guess between the slalom & u-turn
and on the way back to the finish box you are expected to
pick up the pace. HOW WAS I SUPPOSED TO KNOW?

At least if I ever see a series of equally spaced cones when
I'm riding at 10 mph I will be able to avoid hitting them now.
The biggest draw on my past experience goes back to when I raced
autocross... otherwise it would look like a sea of cones because
some cones for a later exercise are on the course in the middle
of the slalom.

One lady who failed really had adequate skills, but she was so
nervous because of not knowing what to really expect that she
basically choked due to anxiety (I don't say choked in a negative
meaning... it's just that it's very intimidating).

Another thing that's difficult is if you miss a cone or make
some error you have to avoid making more mistakes... there
will be a points deduction, but you still can lose even more
on the same exercise if you let a mistake rattle you.

The other thing that saved me from failing was when the examiner
said I could go I refused to be rushed to begin. The timing starts
when you begin moving... I sat there and mentally visualized the
ride through each test section before executing it. That was a
huge help.

I think I still almost failed.

Your ability to safely ride a 3-wheel vehicle on streets & roadways
has very little to do with passing the test. Even an expert rider
who hasn't specifically trained for the test could easily fail.

It would be best if a person could go to the teat site the week
before and watch others take the test, then come and practice
on the test ground (the painted layout is permanent).

I watched some of the two wheelers take their test after us...
that test is even less related to safety on the road.

I seriously doubt many people get killed while slaloming
cones that are 8 feet apart at 10 mph. Slow speed riding
is not what gets most dangerously stupid people killed...
and those are the high profile accidents.

You just can't teach away stupidity. Smart people will heed advice
and learn in a safe manner. Stupid people will not, no matter
what tests you administer.

Quote from claude #3563 on August 25, 2007, 10:33 pm

Originally written by Hack'n on 8/25/2007 11:06 AM

Mark,
You're preaching to the Choir here. Many are unhappy at how this legislation turned out.
Since you are so inflamed regarding this issue, why not become an activist as apposed to a whiner. This may bring about some changes in the rules.
You say you have a Yahoo group. Why not get a movement going going that will try to make some changes in the law instead of the constant sniveling?

Lonnie
Northwest Sidecars

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Too bad that some of the ones who may actually know who they are talking to when voicing the problems with this legislation or maybe some of the ones who felt they were doing the sidecar world such a great favor in getting this thing rolling will not now stand up and try and get it repealed.

Quote from Guest on August 26, 2007, 1:07 pm

I plan on going thru a couple of permits to get my skills up and then taking the safety couse and taking the test that way. I beleve there is a course in Renton which is closer to my house than Belview or Centralla but I do plan on riding at night and taking a passenger useing my 2 wheel endorsement and pleading ignorance

Quote from Guest on August 26, 2007, 3:56 pm

There isn't a 3-wheel course in Renton.
There are 2-wheel test sites all over the place (including Bremerton,
which would have been unbelievably more reasonable for me to take
a test).

There is some talk of adding a 3-wheel test site in Kitsap county,
but it wouldn't have been in a timely schedule for me.

In winter there is only darkness, so I don't see what they
expect people to do during those months. I realize the
idea is that it's a learner's permit so you can practice,
but some people have to work for a living and don't have
time to go practice on the weekends (one reason they can't
always take the MSF course).

Quote from Guest on August 28, 2007, 2:19 pm

Originally written by Mark 42 on 8/9/2007 12:16 PM

I've already spent $693 for registration.
$30 for endorsement.
I figure another $25 to take the riding test.

So how much of my $745 will go to 3-wheel rider education?

I could have easily paid for the training (which I never took,
and would have cost another $100) myself.

There is no fee for the test.

Only monies associated with endorsements/permits go to the Motorcycle Safety Education Fund. Someone else would have to let you know where the registration/tags go. The local office may be able to say for certain.

It cost me another $10 today to turn in the results of the Riding Skills Test
and get my license updated with the new endorsement.
So that makes it $40 to get the endorsemment.
Add to that about 14 hours of my time (not counting time spend studying
for the trivia test), about 100 miles of gasoline, $20 ferry fees for
the test day and it is hardly worth the effort. (Not to mention getting
up at 04:30 to make it to the test site on time)

If I had known how much of a problem this was going to be I doubt
I would have bought a sidecar rig.

The state continues to extract $$$ from me by charging $4.60 extra
per day to have a sidecar on my motorcycle when I ride the ferry to work.
That's about $92 per month.

And I still haven't (legally) taken anyone for a ride in the sidecar
even though I bought may new rig a month ago.

Imagine buying a new car and waiting a month to drive it because it
is not exactly like the other cars you have driven for 30 years...

Quote from Guest on September 5, 2007, 6:26 pm

From Evergreen Safety Coucil's Website

Washington St. subsidizes many of our classes for State residents ($125).
Additional classes have been added at a higher price to meet demand ($225).
Other than price and availability, all classes are identical.

Funny how more money induces availability of classes.