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suspension
Quote from Guest on May 6, 2004, 10:39 pmI have a Velorex 700S mounted to a 1976 R75/6. Windjammer SS fairing, Krauser bags, Vetter trunk. It is time for new fork springs and seals and I was wondering if there is something I should do differently. Heavier springs, change oil weight? Does anyone know of someone in the New Bedford or Cape Cod area that is familiar with sidecars? The rig runs nice but this is all new to me and I can't be sure which wierd sensations I really have to adjust to and which ones can be adjusted out.
Thanks,
Kurt
I have a Velorex 700S mounted to a 1976 R75/6. Windjammer SS fairing, Krauser bags, Vetter trunk. It is time for new fork springs and seals and I was wondering if there is something I should do differently. Heavier springs, change oil weight? Does anyone know of someone in the New Bedford or Cape Cod area that is familiar with sidecars? The rig runs nice but this is all new to me and I can't be sure which wierd sensations I really have to adjust to and which ones can be adjusted out.
Thanks,
Kurt
Quote from Guest on May 7, 2004, 9:49 amProgressive springs would be nice as would stiffer shocks on the rear. But if you want a quick cheap "fix" about a 1 inch long piece of 1/2 inch PCV pipe on top of the springs to pre load the spring helps.
For your bike we also have a set of clamps that move the stock forks forward by 2 1/2 inches which makes for very light steering with the sidecar. They are almost as good as a leading link (which we also make) but at 1/3 the price. The down side to these is that they do not work well with frame mounted fairings like your windjammer.
Jay Giese
Dauntless Motors Corporation
www.dauntlessmotors.com
Progressive springs would be nice as would stiffer shocks on the rear. But if you want a quick cheap "fix" about a 1 inch long piece of 1/2 inch PCV pipe on top of the springs to pre load the spring helps.
For your bike we also have a set of clamps that move the stock forks forward by 2 1/2 inches which makes for very light steering with the sidecar. They are almost as good as a leading link (which we also make) but at 1/3 the price. The down side to these is that they do not work well with frame mounted fairings like your windjammer.
Jay Giese
Dauntless Motors Corporation
http://www.dauntlessmotors.com
Quote from Hack__n on May 7, 2004, 3:32 pmHeavier viscosity fork oil will help to relieve front end dive. Add the PVC slugs (schedule 80) and you will notice a pleasant, inexpensive, change in the front end attitude.
Heavier viscosity fork oil will help to relieve front end dive. Add the PVC slugs (schedule 80) and you will notice a pleasant, inexpensive, change in the front end attitude.
Quote from Guest on May 7, 2004, 7:27 pmJay,
Is that progressive rate springs or Progressive Suspension springs?
The leading links you mentioned, (I'm not prepared to give up the Vetter)are they something you fabricate or are they the Unit set up? Do they use the stock front wheel?
Kurt
Jay,
Is that progressive rate springs or Progressive Suspension springs?
The leading links you mentioned, (I'm not prepared to give up the Vetter)are they something you fabricate or are they the Unit set up? Do they use the stock front wheel?
Kurt
Quote from Guest on May 8, 2004, 11:47 amWe use Progresive brand of suspention componets.
We handle Unit brand of leading links and in the winter months also build links for the BMW's. We can build these to run the stock rotors on the wire wheels but change them over to Brembo calipars from the ATE by adding spacers to the hub where the rotor attaches. We then make the swing arm for the link wider. We can either mount the calipars on the bottom of the swing arm as Unit does which causes the front end to climb on braking or we can float the calipars on top. Or we can stay with the stock ATE calipars but we mount them on the bottom of the swing arm.
Jay Giese
Dauntless Motors Corporation
www.dauntlessmotors.com
We use Progresive brand of suspention componets.
We handle Unit brand of leading links and in the winter months also build links for the BMW's. We can build these to run the stock rotors on the wire wheels but change them over to Brembo calipars from the ATE by adding spacers to the hub where the rotor attaches. We then make the swing arm for the link wider. We can either mount the calipars on the bottom of the swing arm as Unit does which causes the front end to climb on braking or we can float the calipars on top. Or we can stay with the stock ATE calipars but we mount them on the bottom of the swing arm.
Jay Giese
Dauntless Motors Corporation
http://www.dauntlessmotors.com
Quote from Guest on May 8, 2004, 6:15 pmWont be before winter but if I decide to go that route I think the best bet would be your leading link with the Brembo's floated on top but I am also thinking if I'm going to go that far I should put dual disks and maybe something that would allow for a car tire. Other than money, my only hesitation is not knowing how ugly these might be. I have seen some set ups (I believe they were EML)that are really nice looking and I've always liked the look of the old Earle's forks but I've seen a couple at rallies that were just butt ugly. Are dual disks over kill? Do car tires actually have advantages?
Thanks again, I really do appreciate the advice 'cause I have not been able to find reliable information on my side of the country.
Kurt
Wont be before winter but if I decide to go that route I think the best bet would be your leading link with the Brembo's floated on top but I am also thinking if I'm going to go that far I should put dual disks and maybe something that would allow for a car tire. Other than money, my only hesitation is not knowing how ugly these might be. I have seen some set ups (I believe they were EML)that are really nice looking and I've always liked the look of the old Earle's forks but I've seen a couple at rallies that were just butt ugly. Are dual disks over kill? Do car tires actually have advantages?
Thanks again, I really do appreciate the advice 'cause I have not been able to find reliable information on my side of the country.
Kurt
Quote from Guest on May 8, 2004, 10:16 pmI will try to fine some photo's in the next couple of days of a /5 we did with a 15 inch car wheel on the front with dual floating brembo's on the leading link.
Jay Giese
Dauntless Motors Corporation
I will try to fine some photo's in the next couple of days of a /5 we did with a 15 inch car wheel on the front with dual floating brembo's on the leading link.
Jay Giese
Dauntless Motors Corporation
Quote from Guest on May 9, 2004, 10:32 amAlso, We may be able to get you an EML front end. We are working with EML, They want us to sign a contract and every time I ask they say they will send it to me the next day. This has been going on now for better then a month.
Jay Giese
Dauntless Motors Corporation
www.dauntlessmotors.com
Also, We may be able to get you an EML front end. We are working with EML, They want us to sign a contract and every time I ask they say they will send it to me the next day. This has been going on now for better then a month.
Jay Giese
Dauntless Motors Corporation
http://www.dauntlessmotors.com
Quote from Guest on May 26, 2004, 11:44 pmHello Kurt -
You've said you're new to sidecars. Do you know if your rig is set up correctly; does it have the proper lean-out and toe-in? I've set my R75/7-Ural combination with 1-degree leanout, 0.9 inchs toe-in. It's fine that way riding solo or with the dogs, but with a human passenger and the sidecar windshield up it could use a bit more of each to steer straight at highway speeds.
I also found that when I changed from motorcycle tires (Michelin) to sidecar tires (Avon SM Mk II), handling improved dramatically and the wobbling at 15 mph diminished significantly. Tire pressure is another factor; I'm presently using 25 psi in front and sidecar tires, and 38 psi in the pusher.
I'm not familiar with the Velorex 700S, and your adjustments will likly vary from mine because of its different weight, aerodynamics, suspension, and layout (including sidecar wheel lead). But no matter the differences, the proper lean-out, toe-in, and tire pressures are fundamental to the safe and balanced handling of your rig. The on-line books at this site explain each parameter in detail, and are well worth studying. Then it's start at some logical setting and test from there with the loads and at the speeds you will be riding. Eventually, and with patience, your rig won't feel quite as weird.
Let us know how things are going.
Jim
ps - some weirdness is to be expected, and enjoyed.
Hello Kurt -
You've said you're new to sidecars. Do you know if your rig is set up correctly; does it have the proper lean-out and toe-in? I've set my R75/7-Ural combination with 1-degree leanout, 0.9 inchs toe-in. It's fine that way riding solo or with the dogs, but with a human passenger and the sidecar windshield up it could use a bit more of each to steer straight at highway speeds.
I also found that when I changed from motorcycle tires (Michelin) to sidecar tires (Avon SM Mk II), handling improved dramatically and the wobbling at 15 mph diminished significantly. Tire pressure is another factor; I'm presently using 25 psi in front and sidecar tires, and 38 psi in the pusher.
I'm not familiar with the Velorex 700S, and your adjustments will likly vary from mine because of its different weight, aerodynamics, suspension, and layout (including sidecar wheel lead). But no matter the differences, the proper lean-out, toe-in, and tire pressures are fundamental to the safe and balanced handling of your rig. The on-line books at this site explain each parameter in detail, and are well worth studying. Then it's start at some logical setting and test from there with the loads and at the speeds you will be riding. Eventually, and with patience, your rig won't feel quite as weird.
Let us know how things are going.
Jim
ps - some weirdness is to be expected, and enjoyed.
Quote from Guest on May 27, 2004, 3:54 pmJim,
Do I know if my rig is set up correctly? No. Originally she was feeling like she wanted to go off road to the right. I was constantly pushing on the right grip. If I loosened my hold she wouldn't actually drift right she just felt like she wanted to. When I described everything I had measurement wise and gave him the symptoms Bob Wark (another fantastic guy)suggested more toe-in. I'd have gone with leanout but he is muuuch closer to the expert then I am and by golly he was right. Now that I have installed a new set of Progressive Suspension springs she rides great. I no longer have to concentrate on staying on the road so the shifting is much smoother and the wallowing, bobbing and weaving and other such foolishness is gone. Looking at the tape measure it seems like a lot of toe in and leanout but the old country roads I ride everyday are severely crowned and she just goes straight ahead. No pulling left or right. With a 160 lb. passenger she tracks fine at the speed limit out on the highway too so I think I'm going to leave it as is until I get to see how the tire wear is. My wife can't ride on the back of the beemer or my FLT any more because of her back but the seat on the 700S goes way above her head and she arrives at the end of a long ride refreshed and happy (when Mama is happy everybody is happy, when she is not.....) so I think we did a good thing.
Thanks for the help.
Kurt
Jim,
Do I know if my rig is set up correctly? No. Originally she was feeling like she wanted to go off road to the right. I was constantly pushing on the right grip. If I loosened my hold she wouldn't actually drift right she just felt like she wanted to. When I described everything I had measurement wise and gave him the symptoms Bob Wark (another fantastic guy)suggested more toe-in. I'd have gone with leanout but he is muuuch closer to the expert then I am and by golly he was right. Now that I have installed a new set of Progressive Suspension springs she rides great. I no longer have to concentrate on staying on the road so the shifting is much smoother and the wallowing, bobbing and weaving and other such foolishness is gone. Looking at the tape measure it seems like a lot of toe in and leanout but the old country roads I ride everyday are severely crowned and she just goes straight ahead. No pulling left or right. With a 160 lb. passenger she tracks fine at the speed limit out on the highway too so I think I'm going to leave it as is until I get to see how the tire wear is. My wife can't ride on the back of the beemer or my FLT any more because of her back but the seat on the 700S goes way above her head and she arrives at the end of a long ride refreshed and happy (when Mama is happy everybody is happy, when she is not.....) so I think we did a good thing.
Thanks for the help.
Kurt