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Opinions on Velorex 560 to Moto Guzzi Ambassador
Quote from maquette on December 24, 2008, 10:01 amI'd like to have your opinions on the above combo. I'm particularly interested in your thoughts on the strength (or lack of) and usability of the Velorex? Subframe, or no? I plan to run this combo, but am interested in the collective wisdom of the list to it's pluses and minuses. I just like the way it looks with the Loop frame Guzzi.
Thanks,
Tom
I'd like to have your opinions on the above combo. I'm particularly interested in your thoughts on the strength (or lack of) and usability of the Velorex? Subframe, or no? I plan to run this combo, but am interested in the collective wisdom of the list to it's pluses and minuses. I just like the way it looks with the Loop frame Guzzi.
Thanks,
Tom
Quote from Hack__n on December 24, 2008, 1:12 pmThe loop frame Guzzi's will connect up well with a minimum of sub-frame bracketry. A sub-frame is handy if you have wheel lead issues.
Lonnie
The loop frame Guzzi's will connect up well with a minimum of sub-frame bracketry. A sub-frame is handy if you have wheel lead issues.
Lonnie
Quote from GuzziDon on December 26, 2008, 6:48 amTom;
You need to contact Howard Gilbert at > gilberth@pacbell.net <, He has an Eldo with Jawa/Velorex 560 sidecar that he is very happy with. And you're correct...they look beautiful together.Don
Tom;
You need to contact Howard Gilbert at > gilberth@pacbell.net <, He has an Eldo with Jawa/Velorex 560 sidecar that he is very happy with. And you're correct...they look beautiful together.
Don
Quote from gilberth on December 26, 2008, 9:31 amTom,
Don should know, he spent many hours helping me set it up.
I love my rig. It handles beautifully and draws my admiring stares and thumbs up.
I'll try to update the photos to this site.
Howard
'74 Eldorado & '72 Jawa/Velo 560 aka Romalotta
Tom,
Don should know, he spent many hours helping me set it up.
I love my rig. It handles beautifully and draws my admiring stares and thumbs up.
I'll try to update the photos to this site.
Howard
'74 Eldorado & '72 Jawa/Velo 560 aka Romalotta
Quote from maquette on December 26, 2008, 11:27 amThanks to all who have replied. I gained some valuable info from Lonnie via email and have some pictures from Howard to help me along. Other info and opinions would be welcome, particularly along the lines of whether or not to use a subframe and what brand of "U" clamps to use. I noticed on Howard's application that you welded a plate to the sidecar frame. Was that to strengthen the frame, add ballast, or both?
Thanks to all who have replied. I gained some valuable info from Lonnie via email and have some pictures from Howard to help me along. Other info and opinions would be welcome, particularly along the lines of whether or not to use a subframe and what brand of "U" clamps to use. I noticed on Howard's application that you welded a plate to the sidecar frame. Was that to strengthen the frame, add ballast, or both?
Quote from gilberth on December 26, 2008, 12:13 pmTom,
I had the steel plate welded in the s/c frame to add both strength and ballast. In addition I add a 50# bag of sand behind the s/c seat when
I don't have a passenger. More experienced drivers may not need this additional ballast but I just have a year of experience under my belt
and I tend to be very cautious.
Howard
Tom,
I had the steel plate welded in the s/c frame to add both strength and ballast. In addition I add a 50# bag of sand behind the s/c seat when
I don't have a passenger. More experienced drivers may not need this additional ballast but I just have a year of experience under my belt
and I tend to be very cautious.
Howard
Quote from Hack__n on December 26, 2008, 1:46 pmI use both OEM Jawa/Velorex (less expensive but paint finish) U-clamps $50.00 or Heavier duty (more expensive and bright plated) assemblies. $75.00.
I stock both here.Lonnie
Northwest Sidecars, LLC
I use both OEM Jawa/Velorex (less expensive but paint finish) U-clamps $50.00 or Heavier duty (more expensive and bright plated) assemblies. $75.00.
I stock both here.
Lonnie
Northwest Sidecars, LLC
Quote from maquette on December 26, 2008, 2:07 pmLonnie,
As soon as I figure out what mounting configuration I'm going to use I'll get with you on the clamps. I may have to source some lower struts as well.
Thanks.
Lonnie,
As soon as I figure out what mounting configuration I'm going to use I'll get with you on the clamps. I may have to source some lower struts as well.
Thanks.
Quote from SidecarMike on December 26, 2008, 9:58 pmBeautius Howard, just Beautius! :0) You do nice work.
Beautius Howard, just Beautius! :0) You do nice work.
Quote from Guest on March 9, 2011, 11:47 pmI'd like to have your opinions on the above combo. The loop frame Guzzi's will connect up well with a minimum of sub-frame bracketry.
I'd like to have your opinions on the above combo. The loop frame Guzzi's will connect up well with a minimum of sub-frame bracketry.
Quote from Hack__n on March 10, 2011, 3:14 pmThe weak points in the 560/Guzzi applications are the 15mm axle, soft suspension and 18" wheel. There are three different mount setups that came with the 560 dependent upon whether it was going to be attached to a 350 or 500 Jawa, same sized CZ or an aftermarket (universal) mount set. All were designed for lightweight 300# plus motorcycles.
They do make a pleasing to the eye retro look combo.Lonnie
The weak points in the 560/Guzzi applications are the 15mm axle, soft suspension and 18" wheel. There are three different mount setups that came with the 560 dependent upon whether it was going to be attached to a 350 or 500 Jawa, same sized CZ or an aftermarket (universal) mount set. All were designed for lightweight 300# plus motorcycles.
They do make a pleasing to the eye retro look combo.
Lonnie
Quote from gilberth on March 18, 2011, 9:12 amIt took me a long time but I finally found a great replacement shock for the 560.
It's the PRO-X-290 from EPM Performance Imports and is only $58.
Also DomiRacer has a 3.25 x 18 tire that wears and handles well.
I have about 5,000 mi on this rig and with added ballast and proper mounting,
I feel it is a great looking and handling combo.
Howard
Napa, CA
It took me a long time but I finally found a great replacement shock for the 560.
It's the PRO-X-290 from EPM Performance Imports and is only $58.
Also DomiRacer has a 3.25 x 18 tire that wears and handles well.
I have about 5,000 mi on this rig and with added ballast and proper mounting,
I feel it is a great looking and handling combo.
Howard
Napa, CA
Quote from mittelme on June 13, 2012, 1:43 amhi new to the forumgot a velorex 560 1974 attached to goldwing gl1000 1978 suffer from very soft sidecar per gilberth advice order the PRO-X-290 shock hope it will help.need advice regarding sidecar wheel angle my is tilt in and the the weighty need in the sidcar and the wat to atached it to sidecar or frame.
Quote from Hack__n on June 13, 2012, 9:33 amYour sidecar appears to be sitting fairly level. If the frame is level the wheel should also be level. Some of these light sidecars have had warped (twisted) swing-arms and bent (15mm) axles as a result of being mounted on bikes that were over twice the weight of the lightweight 350-500 Jawas they were designed for. Another problem I've found is that the shock towers on some of the 560s are not set at 90 degrees to the sidecar frame which also affects the axle position. Your wheel camber could be the result of one or more of these conditions.
If using removable ballast it should be soft so it will not damage the fiberglass body if it shifts. Place it in the trunk area, not in front. 25#Shot bags are nice but pricey. Sand is cheap.
Frame mounted ballast should be bolted or welded to the frame preferably to the rear and outboard. The farther outboard, the less weight is needed.
Jawa-Velorex has recommended up to 100# ballast (in the past) for non passenger use.Lonnie
Your sidecar appears to be sitting fairly level. If the frame is level the wheel should also be level. Some of these light sidecars have had warped (twisted) swing-arms and bent (15mm) axles as a result of being mounted on bikes that were over twice the weight of the lightweight 350-500 Jawas they were designed for. Another problem I've found is that the shock towers on some of the 560s are not set at 90 degrees to the sidecar frame which also affects the axle position. Your wheel camber could be the result of one or more of these conditions.
If using removable ballast it should be soft so it will not damage the fiberglass body if it shifts. Place it in the trunk area, not in front. 25#Shot bags are nice but pricey. Sand is cheap.
Frame mounted ballast should be bolted or welded to the frame preferably to the rear and outboard. The farther outboard, the less weight is needed.
Jawa-Velorex has recommended up to 100# ballast (in the past) for non passenger use.
Lonnie
Quote from gilberth on June 13, 2012, 10:04 amOn my rig I try to do lean in/lean out measurements with a helper and me sitting on the bike.
Helps to get a more accurate picture.
Check to make sure that the axle is not bent.
Road test it.
For ballast I have a steel plate welding inside the frame. If I'm not carrying a small passenger I usually carry a 50 pound sandbag.
I also have lowered the rig about 3 & 1/2" which adds to the looks also well as improving the cornering.
'74 Moto Guzzi Eldorado w/ Jawa/velorex 560 s/c
On my rig I try to do lean in/lean out measurements with a helper and me sitting on the bike.
Helps to get a more accurate picture.
Check to make sure that the axle is not bent.
Road test it.
For ballast I have a steel plate welding inside the frame. If I'm not carrying a small passenger I usually carry a 50 pound sandbag.
I also have lowered the rig about 3 & 1/2" which adds to the looks also well as improving the cornering.
'74 Moto Guzzi Eldorado w/ Jawa/velorex 560 s/c
Quote from mittelme on June 14, 2012, 12:48 amThanks to Hack'n and gilberth
it look that the shock tower is 90 degrees to the frame and also the 15mm axles look ok on the frame maybe i need to take it out from the tower assemblye and test it.
what is the way to get the 15mm axles from the structure?regard
eli
Thanks to Hack'n and gilberth
it look that the shock tower is 90 degrees to the frame and also the 15mm axles look ok on the frame maybe i need to take it out from the tower assemblye and test it.
what is the way to get the 15mm axles from the structure?
regard
eli
Quote from gilberth on June 14, 2012, 10:11 amEli,
Not sure why you want to take the suspension assembly off the sidecar to 'test' the axle.
If you do take want to remove the assembly from the frame it's not hard to do so as there are 4 bolts holding it on.
Be sure when you replace the bolts and nuts with hardened steel, grade 8.
Howard
Napa, CA
Eli,
Not sure why you want to take the suspension assembly off the sidecar to 'test' the axle.
If you do take want to remove the assembly from the frame it's not hard to do so as there are 4 bolts holding it on.
Be sure when you replace the bolts and nuts with hardened steel, grade 8.
Howard
Napa, CA
Quote from Hack__n on June 14, 2012, 10:49 amThe axles are press fit. Some are quite loose, some aren't. I've only had one that wouldn't come out using a brass drift to protect the threads (axle nut in place reversed).
Metric replacement for the bolts would be grade 88.8 or 10.5.I have a couple of good axles in stock here.
Lonnie
Northwest Sidecars
The axles are press fit. Some are quite loose, some aren't. I've only had one that wouldn't come out using a brass drift to protect the threads (axle nut in place reversed).
Metric replacement for the bolts would be grade 88.8 or 10.5.
I have a couple of good axles in stock here.
Lonnie
Northwest Sidecars