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Greetings and questions about bike size.....
Quote from Guest on December 26, 2007, 5:36 pmHello everyone. I am new to the board. I don't yet have a sidecar but have reached the time of life where I want and need one. My wife falls asleep on the back of motorcycles and I'm afraid she'll fall off. After reviewing options, we've decided a sidecar is the way to go. I'm not fond of (and don't have the budget for) large touring bikes (think Goldwing or large Harley touring bike - something big enough to have a barcalounger back seat with armrests)and I don't grok trikes either.
My question(s) revolve around how big a bike/rig do you need? I'd like to be able to haul me (300 pounds), the wife (200) and 3 chihuauas ('bout 30). I'd like enough power for reasonable freeway cruising - 75mph with a little passing reserve when loaded.
I was unable to find any discussion on this subject - likley I'm not searching correctly 'cause I figure this must be a common topic.
I like Urals but the claimed top speed of 65mph and admonishments on the Ural forum that 65 sustained is asking for trouble make that seem a poor choice for me.
Likewise when I see BMW R75/5s (or other mid-displacment set-ups)for sale with a sidecar - I wonder what the performance is like.I'm starting with a clean slate - my only bike right now is a Stella motorscooter (no sidecar). I have owned other, large bikes - a Kawi Concours being the heaviest and one of the more powerful. I have zero seat time on a side car.
What is a reasonable, new bike or bike/sidecar combo? Budget is a consideration. What kind of engine size/power will I need? What other features are good to have on a bike that is going to see sidecar use? Bikes I'm fond of are Triumph Bonneville (Hinkley - not Meriden ;),Moto-Guzzi Vintage California 3, 1200 Sportster.
Right now are year end clearance sales and I've been looking at Yamaha Star 1100s and 1700s - a large displacement cruiser would seem to have the perfect engine for a sidecar. How about some of the 750-900 cc cruisers? Too small? I'd sort of like the sidecar to match the bike - I'm guessing a vintage styled sidecar given the bikes I've been thinking of.Thank you very much for entertaining my questions.
Dave
Hello everyone. I am new to the board. I don't yet have a sidecar but have reached the time of life where I want and need one. My wife falls asleep on the back of motorcycles and I'm afraid she'll fall off. After reviewing options, we've decided a sidecar is the way to go. I'm not fond of (and don't have the budget for) large touring bikes (think Goldwing or large Harley touring bike - something big enough to have a barcalounger back seat with armrests)and I don't grok trikes either.
My question(s) revolve around how big a bike/rig do you need? I'd like to be able to haul me (300 pounds), the wife (200) and 3 chihuauas ('bout 30). I'd like enough power for reasonable freeway cruising - 75mph with a little passing reserve when loaded.
I was unable to find any discussion on this subject - likley I'm not searching correctly 'cause I figure this must be a common topic.
I like Urals but the claimed top speed of 65mph and admonishments on the Ural forum that 65 sustained is asking for trouble make that seem a poor choice for me.
Likewise when I see BMW R75/5s (or other mid-displacment set-ups)for sale with a sidecar - I wonder what the performance is like.
I'm starting with a clean slate - my only bike right now is a Stella motorscooter (no sidecar). I have owned other, large bikes - a Kawi Concours being the heaviest and one of the more powerful. I have zero seat time on a side car.
What is a reasonable, new bike or bike/sidecar combo? Budget is a consideration. What kind of engine size/power will I need? What other features are good to have on a bike that is going to see sidecar use? Bikes I'm fond of are Triumph Bonneville (Hinkley - not Meriden ;),Moto-Guzzi Vintage California 3, 1200 Sportster.
Right now are year end clearance sales and I've been looking at Yamaha Star 1100s and 1700s - a large displacement cruiser would seem to have the perfect engine for a sidecar. How about some of the 750-900 cc cruisers? Too small? I'd sort of like the sidecar to match the bike - I'm guessing a vintage styled sidecar given the bikes I've been thinking of.
Thank you very much for entertaining my questions.
Dave
Quote from Guest on December 26, 2007, 6:23 pmI found it rather valuable to actually try driving a sidecar outfit prior to making purchase arrangements. Before that, I spent a good deal of time reading new and old texts on the subject of sidecaring including Hough's training manual and Hal Kendalls publications on the subject. These later are available on this web site and worth researching and studying. Then I approached a dealer who took me out on a quiet day and let me try an outfit at slow speeds. It was really different from anything I'd ever experienced and a sobering reminder that I would need to take training or else take a long time practicing on my own prior to facing regular traffic. Even with some trepidition I realized that I wanted a sidecar. With the first hurdle of simple awareness behind me I, too faced your issue of what could I afford. In the end I went with the best sidecar I could afford and took out a loan to buy it. I justified this by looking at it from the point of amortization. It will cost alot up front but since I intend to keep it a long time it will become increasingly affordable with each year.
One thing you will discover is that more and more sidecaring professionals (I'm not one of them) see an outfit as a permanent 3 wheel vehicle and not a detachable accessory. Long ago, with lower speeds many people preferred to take sidecars off in good weather and return to solo riding. That doesn't seem to be the popular approach anymore. Related to this point, I found that, after I had alignment changes done to my motorcycle's front end (for better steeting) that even if I wanted to make change back it would take weeks of work and so my old solo motorcycle is now a permanent sidecar outfit. If I want solo riding I just use another motorcycle now.
As you look at your prime movers (aka motorcycles) be aware that some bikes do not have frames conducive to sidecaring. Not to worry however because many of our more clever sidecar manufacturers and dealers can provide subframe components that go on the motorcycle and then are used to bolt the sidecar to. Of course the subframe and subsequent labor will add a hefty addition to you costs so if you want to avoid this double check with dealers before making a purchase.
Some of the more traditional motorcycle manufacturers still make bikes that are sidecar compatible but as you've noticed sometimes engine displacements haven't kept up with highway speeds and needs. I know that Enfield still sells outfits but at 500cc they're even smaller than Ural outfits. Harley Davidson's big twin is a fine prime mover with gobs of torque and they even make their own sidecar but you'll have to face the facts of the typical Harley mark up but if you want a traditional look you can't beat a Harley with a Hack. Additionally there are special Harley sidecar manufacturers such as Liberty that make an advanced version of the Harley sidecar for a retro look but with better handling and comfort than the factory model.
BMW once world renowned for sidecar outfits and bikes with leading link forks are sadly committed to the solo world only for the past 40 years or so but you can still use them as prime movers as subframe assemblies are available.
I've seen the big Suzuki scooters around town with sidecars but the owners only used them at urban speeds so I don't know how they would do on highways. Heck I've even seen an old Vespa with a sidecar on it but the owner told me he only uses it for shopping and pet hauling.
If your heart is really in this then take time and enjoy the research of it and try and visit sidecar events if you are lucky enough to be near where they are happening. Sidecarists are rare and anyone with genuine interest is usually given a warm welcome and plenty of help and suggestions.
I've operated my outfit for two years now and have had no regrets as to cost, quality or experiences. In fact even though I've got other solo bikes for summer use the sidecar has become my all time favorite. I love it and feel like a one-man parade every time I go out on it.
Best wishes
I found it rather valuable to actually try driving a sidecar outfit prior to making purchase arrangements. Before that, I spent a good deal of time reading new and old texts on the subject of sidecaring including Hough's training manual and Hal Kendalls publications on the subject. These later are available on this web site and worth researching and studying. Then I approached a dealer who took me out on a quiet day and let me try an outfit at slow speeds. It was really different from anything I'd ever experienced and a sobering reminder that I would need to take training or else take a long time practicing on my own prior to facing regular traffic. Even with some trepidition I realized that I wanted a sidecar. With the first hurdle of simple awareness behind me I, too faced your issue of what could I afford. In the end I went with the best sidecar I could afford and took out a loan to buy it. I justified this by looking at it from the point of amortization. It will cost alot up front but since I intend to keep it a long time it will become increasingly affordable with each year.
One thing you will discover is that more and more sidecaring professionals (I'm not one of them) see an outfit as a permanent 3 wheel vehicle and not a detachable accessory. Long ago, with lower speeds many people preferred to take sidecars off in good weather and return to solo riding. That doesn't seem to be the popular approach anymore. Related to this point, I found that, after I had alignment changes done to my motorcycle's front end (for better steeting) that even if I wanted to make change back it would take weeks of work and so my old solo motorcycle is now a permanent sidecar outfit. If I want solo riding I just use another motorcycle now.
As you look at your prime movers (aka motorcycles) be aware that some bikes do not have frames conducive to sidecaring. Not to worry however because many of our more clever sidecar manufacturers and dealers can provide subframe components that go on the motorcycle and then are used to bolt the sidecar to. Of course the subframe and subsequent labor will add a hefty addition to you costs so if you want to avoid this double check with dealers before making a purchase.
Some of the more traditional motorcycle manufacturers still make bikes that are sidecar compatible but as you've noticed sometimes engine displacements haven't kept up with highway speeds and needs. I know that Enfield still sells outfits but at 500cc they're even smaller than Ural outfits. Harley Davidson's big twin is a fine prime mover with gobs of torque and they even make their own sidecar but you'll have to face the facts of the typical Harley mark up but if you want a traditional look you can't beat a Harley with a Hack. Additionally there are special Harley sidecar manufacturers such as Liberty that make an advanced version of the Harley sidecar for a retro look but with better handling and comfort than the factory model.
BMW once world renowned for sidecar outfits and bikes with leading link forks are sadly committed to the solo world only for the past 40 years or so but you can still use them as prime movers as subframe assemblies are available.
I've seen the big Suzuki scooters around town with sidecars but the owners only used them at urban speeds so I don't know how they would do on highways. Heck I've even seen an old Vespa with a sidecar on it but the owner told me he only uses it for shopping and pet hauling.
If your heart is really in this then take time and enjoy the research of it and try and visit sidecar events if you are lucky enough to be near where they are happening. Sidecarists are rare and anyone with genuine interest is usually given a warm welcome and plenty of help and suggestions.
I've operated my outfit for two years now and have had no regrets as to cost, quality or experiences. In fact even though I've got other solo bikes for summer use the sidecar has become my all time favorite. I love it and feel like a one-man parade every time I go out on it.
Best wishes
Quote from Guest on December 26, 2007, 6:48 pmThanks for asking entertaining questions.
When I ride on the back of someone else's bike, I'm fast asleep within the first mile. Every time.
I'd say you're looking at 1000cc's at least. Smaller engines would work with lower gearing, but then your top speeds come back down again. I have heard of people putting BMW engines in a Ural, but that would take more work than you're probably interested in.
I personally prefer a more upright, neutral riding position, so it would sem a 1200 Sportster would be a good choice. There're probably a jillion good used ones around. V-Star 1100 would work, too, though.
Some bikes will need a sub-frame and heavier springs, so keep that in mond when adding up costs. I like the idea of the Guzzi- that would probably be my choice out of the ones you mentioned.
Thanks for asking entertaining questions.
When I ride on the back of someone else's bike, I'm fast asleep within the first mile. Every time.
I'd say you're looking at 1000cc's at least. Smaller engines would work with lower gearing, but then your top speeds come back down again. I have heard of people putting BMW engines in a Ural, but that would take more work than you're probably interested in.
I personally prefer a more upright, neutral riding position, so it would sem a 1200 Sportster would be a good choice. There're probably a jillion good used ones around. V-Star 1100 would work, too, though.
Some bikes will need a sub-frame and heavier springs, so keep that in mond when adding up costs. I like the idea of the Guzzi- that would probably be my choice out of the ones you mentioned.
Quote from Hack__n on December 26, 2007, 7:11 pmOf your preferred bikes, I have set up all 3 as sidecar rigs and the Guzzi would be my choice for an all around sidecar tug. Many of the later models are quite inexpensive to buy and mount up a sidecar easily. Lots of low end torque, fuel injection, shaft drive for smooth operation, factory steering damper and a very reliable bike.
Lonnie
Northwest Sidecars
Of your preferred bikes, I have set up all 3 as sidecar rigs and the Guzzi would be my choice for an all around sidecar tug. Many of the later models are quite inexpensive to buy and mount up a sidecar easily. Lots of low end torque, fuel injection, shaft drive for smooth operation, factory steering damper and a very reliable bike.
Lonnie
Northwest Sidecars
Quote from Guest on December 26, 2007, 7:34 pmHey Uncle Ernie,
I have a Sportster 1200 w/ Cozy Euro..great for kids dog groceries dumpruns Christmas trees and small adults handles great.
my Sporty is quite peppy...
Happy Healthy many carefree safe rides New Year!
Liz
Hey Uncle Ernie,
I have a Sportster 1200 w/ Cozy Euro..great for kids dog groceries dumpruns Christmas trees and small adults handles great.
my Sporty is quite peppy...
Happy Healthy many carefree safe rides New Year!
Liz
Quote from SidecarMike on December 26, 2007, 9:33 pmI looked very closely at the new Vintage before I bought my V11 last month. It would be very easy to hack one. Had my budget been just a little bigger, I'd be riding one today.
I looked very closely at the new Vintage before I bought my V11 last month. It would be very easy to hack one. Had my budget been just a little bigger, I'd be riding one today.
Quote from carney on December 26, 2007, 9:54 pmDave, where in Louisiana are you? I live in Alexandria and I ride with Bud Amy who lives in Port Barre, he has a BMW R90/6 Ural, me a BMW R100/EML rig. Boy that R90/6 of Bud's will pull a car.
We'd be glad to meet and talk with ya.
carneyrobertson
Dave, where in Louisiana are you? I live in Alexandria and I ride with Bud Amy who lives in Port Barre, he has a BMW R90/6 Ural, me a BMW R100/EML rig. Boy that R90/6 of Bud's will pull a car.
We'd be glad to meet and talk with ya.
carneyrobertson
Quote from Guest on December 26, 2007, 10:21 pmOriginally written by carney on 12/26/2007 9:54 PM
Dave, where in Louisiana are you? I live in Alexandria and I ride with Bud Amy who lives in Port Barre, he has a BMW R90/6 Ural, me a BMW R100/EML rig. Boy that R90/6 of Bud's will pull a car.
We'd be glad to meet and talk with ya.
carneyrobertsonPaydirt! I'll be d****d. It so happens I live in Pollock (near Pineville). I lived in Colfax till about a year ago. It also happens I used to ride Beemers in the '80s and bemoan the fact that there are few (if any) bikes out that have the same virtues of a '70s-'80s beemer - light weight, neutral seating, flat seat, air cooled, simple, rational etc . The Sportster (with "rubber mount" engine), Bonneville and California Vintage coming the closest. If I had the budget, the California would be mine now. Vespa of Baton Rouge has a new one, heavily discounted - a sweet deal. Unfortunately, even discounted it is more than a 1200 Sportster or Triumph. It is WAY more than a discounted 1100 V Star. 🙁
It also just happens that a guy in NOLA is selling a '74 R75/6 with sidecar for cheap. I swore I didn't want an old bike but I've been lusting after a 74 r75/r90 without a toaster tank (toaster tank = gaaahk 😉 An r75 sidecar rig at a good price might do as a starter rig (and give me time to save my pennies for a Guzzi). We'll see what kind of shape it's in.
Carney, I'd love to meet you and Bud and get the sidecar lowdown 1st hand. I'll PM you with my email/cell phone.
Thanks for the feedback everyone - I'm still looking forward to more of it.
Miss Liz - that was a great pic of your Sporty and Christmas tree 🙂 The smile on your face is a big reason sidecars appeal to me - I've seen that smile on many pictures of hack owners. There must be something to it!
Originally written by carney on 12/26/2007 9:54 PM
Dave, where in Louisiana are you? I live in Alexandria and I ride with Bud Amy who lives in Port Barre, he has a BMW R90/6 Ural, me a BMW R100/EML rig. Boy that R90/6 of Bud's will pull a car.
We'd be glad to meet and talk with ya.
carneyrobertson
Paydirt! I'll be d****d. It so happens I live in Pollock (near Pineville). I lived in Colfax till about a year ago. It also happens I used to ride Beemers in the '80s and bemoan the fact that there are few (if any) bikes out that have the same virtues of a '70s-'80s beemer - light weight, neutral seating, flat seat, air cooled, simple, rational etc . The Sportster (with "rubber mount" engine), Bonneville and California Vintage coming the closest. If I had the budget, the California would be mine now. Vespa of Baton Rouge has a new one, heavily discounted - a sweet deal. Unfortunately, even discounted it is more than a 1200 Sportster or Triumph. It is WAY more than a discounted 1100 V Star. 🙁
It also just happens that a guy in NOLA is selling a '74 R75/6 with sidecar for cheap. I swore I didn't want an old bike but I've been lusting after a 74 r75/r90 without a toaster tank (toaster tank = gaaahk 😉 An r75 sidecar rig at a good price might do as a starter rig (and give me time to save my pennies for a Guzzi). We'll see what kind of shape it's in.
Carney, I'd love to meet you and Bud and get the sidecar lowdown 1st hand. I'll PM you with my email/cell phone.
Thanks for the feedback everyone - I'm still looking forward to more of it.
Miss Liz - that was a great pic of your Sporty and Christmas tree 🙂 The smile on your face is a big reason sidecars appeal to me - I've seen that smile on many pictures of hack owners. There must be something to it!
Quote from Guest on December 27, 2007, 10:56 amDave,
You bet! Having a great time with her..this is my first bike/rig, always
wanted a sidecar...(beats being an ornament on the back!)
People that stop to look/see always talk about good memories with the thrill of a child ,remembering grandparents and childhood memories of sidecars ...always leaving with a smile after sharing.
PS last time I was in La was as a relief nurse for Katrina...hope things are better.....
Dave,
You bet! Having a great time with her..this is my first bike/rig, always
wanted a sidecar...(beats being an ornament on the back!)
People that stop to look/see always talk about good memories with the thrill of a child ,remembering grandparents and childhood memories of sidecars ...always leaving with a smile after sharing.
PS last time I was in La was as a relief nurse for Katrina...hope things are better.....
Quote from SwampFox on December 27, 2007, 1:12 pmHi Dave:
Welcome from a fellow Louisiana resident. I am working towards mounting a sidecar to a 2002 883R Sportster and have received much insight and advice from Carney in Boyce (IIRC) and Carl in Keithville -- Look for my first post asking if there's anyone in the Ark-La-Tex area. I don't yet have enough experience to add much, but I'm always happy to visit and "discuss."
Good luck with your search,
Lee
Summer Grove, LA USA
rleeryder@bellsouth.net
Hi Dave:
Welcome from a fellow Louisiana resident. I am working towards mounting a sidecar to a 2002 883R Sportster and have received much insight and advice from Carney in Boyce (IIRC) and Carl in Keithville -- Look for my first post asking if there's anyone in the Ark-La-Tex area. I don't yet have enough experience to add much, but I'm always happy to visit and "discuss."
Good luck with your search,
Lee
Summer Grove, LA USA
rleeryder@bellsouth.net
Quote from Guest on December 27, 2007, 11:31 pmHi Lee - a couple more Louisiana residents with sidecars, eh? Seems like I stumbled into a whole nest of y'all. Almost enough people for a crawfish boil in the spring (heh heh).
I had a real nice call from Carney today - I'm really looking forward to meeting him and seeing his rig and BS some more about bikes and RVs and stuff. It seems we have Beemers, Rotax engined MZs and RVing in the Pacific Northwest in common.
Thank you all for the warm welcome and the advice.
Hi Lee - a couple more Louisiana residents with sidecars, eh? Seems like I stumbled into a whole nest of y'all. Almost enough people for a crawfish boil in the spring (heh heh).
I had a real nice call from Carney today - I'm really looking forward to meeting him and seeing his rig and BS some more about bikes and RVs and stuff. It seems we have Beemers, Rotax engined MZs and RVing in the Pacific Northwest in common.
Thank you all for the warm welcome and the advice.