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Angle? What Angle?!
Quote from soupy1957 on January 29, 2018, 8:45 amI remember when I went to go pick up the Royal Enfield with a sidecar and the guy told me about how they had to offset the angle of the sidecar in relationship to the motorcycle, by something like 2 or 3°. What’s that about? Why is an angle necessary?
I remember when I went to go pick up the Royal Enfield with a sidecar and the guy told me about how they had to offset the angle of the sidecar in relationship to the motorcycle, by something like 2 or 3°. What’s that about? Why is an angle necessary?
Quote from Peter Pan on January 29, 2018, 9:32 amread the books. http://sidecar.com/links3.asp
in the german manual page 29 onwards.
read the books. http://sidecar.com/links3.asp
in the german manual page 29 onwards.
Quote from soupy1957 on January 29, 2018, 10:18 amThe only instructions I found relative to aligning a sidecar to a motorcycle, were found on page 618, which is FAR from page 29, and States the following:
“Have the motorcycle perpendicular. Insert the studs in the sidecar lugs (in steering head forging, seat post cluster and above three-speed bracket).
Put in the studs from right to left and put the nuts on the left side. Turn the studs so that their joints will be in line. Be sure to tighten the nuts.
See that the clamp on the short connection (the one which clamps the double tube at the left side of the sidecar frame) is loose. Put the front connection on the stud; then put the short connection in place and tighten the clamp nut with the fingers.
Tighten the nuts on the front and short connections at the studs. Bring the sidecar wheel vertical and with its track approximately parallel to that of the rear wheel.
Prevent the wheel from moving out of this position; then put on the rear long connection (from the lug under the scat post cluster to the sidecar rear frame tube).
Set up the nuts and clamps. Put on the long front connection and set up its nuts and clamps. Go over all nuts and see that they are tight before using the sidcar outfit.”I saw nothing about the angles chosen or specified. At least not directly connected to an alignment of 2 to 3°. I find the initial comment in this quote about perpendicularity to be rather odd, since the bike is basically parallel to the sidecar.
The only instructions I found relative to aligning a sidecar to a motorcycle, were found on page 618, which is FAR from page 29, and States the following:
“Have the motorcycle perpendicular. Insert the studs in the sidecar lugs (in steering head forging, seat post cluster and above three-speed bracket).
Put in the studs from right to left and put the nuts on the left side. Turn the studs so that their joints will be in line. Be sure to tighten the nuts.
See that the clamp on the short connection (the one which clamps the double tube at the left side of the sidecar frame) is loose. Put the front connection on the stud; then put the short connection in place and tighten the clamp nut with the fingers.
Tighten the nuts on the front and short connections at the studs. Bring the sidecar wheel vertical and with its track approximately parallel to that of the rear wheel.
Prevent the wheel from moving out of this position; then put on the rear long connection (from the lug under the scat post cluster to the sidecar rear frame tube).
Set up the nuts and clamps. Put on the long front connection and set up its nuts and clamps. Go over all nuts and see that they are tight before using the sidcar outfit.”
I saw nothing about the angles chosen or specified. At least not directly connected to an alignment of 2 to 3°. I find the initial comment in this quote about perpendicularity to be rather odd, since the bike is basically parallel to the sidecar.
Quote from jaydmc on January 29, 2018, 10:56 amWhen you are setting up the sidecar you in theory are on a level floor, the road has a crown to it, the goal is to have the bike straight up and down when you are out in the real world. I have attached the instructions we send out. Also on our site are three video's the first tells you about us. The next two show the entire installation process for one of our Tomahawk SE sidecars onto an Indian Road Master www.dmcsidecars.com/video
Jay G
DMC sidecars
866-638-1793
www.dmcsidecars.com
When you are setting up the sidecar you in theory are on a level floor, the road has a crown to it, the goal is to have the bike straight up and down when you are out in the real world. I have attached the instructions we send out. Also on our site are three video's the first tells you about us. The next two show the entire installation process for one of our Tomahawk SE sidecars onto an Indian Road Master http://www.dmcsidecars.com/video
Jay G
DMC sidecars
866-638-1793
http://www.dmcsidecars.com
Quote from Valkrider on February 1, 2018, 7:53 pmI once tried using an iPhone angle app to try and check my toe in just to see if it would work. I have about 3/4 inch toe in on a 98 Valkyrie and the app which resolved degrees in tenths wouldn't show anything. I guess one could do the math but from what I saw 2 or 3 degree toe in would be a huge amount. Way too much and if so something is really wrong some where.
I once tried using an iPhone angle app to try and check my toe in just to see if it would work. I have about 3/4 inch toe in on a 98 Valkyrie and the app which resolved degrees in tenths wouldn't show anything. I guess one could do the math but from what I saw 2 or 3 degree toe in would be a huge amount. Way too much and if so something is really wrong some where.
Quote from Valkrider on February 4, 2018, 7:48 pmtimo482 - 2/4/2018 10:42 AM
don't confuse "toe in" with "lean angle" - not even vaguely the same thing
to
Never 🙂 To me it definitely sounds like the reference is to toe in. Whatever.
timo482 - 2/4/2018 10:42 AM
don't confuse "toe in" with "lean angle" - not even vaguely the same thing
to
Never 🙂 To me it definitely sounds like the reference is to toe in. Whatever.
Quote from Valkrider on February 4, 2018, 9:07 pmtimo482 - 2/4/2018 7:48 PM
an iPhone using the level program can measure lean - but not toe in
Actuall used the level app to set my lean in but was using a compass app to try and measure toe in. Anyway I worked out that the toe in on my Valkyrie with a 3 degree offset would be about 4.2 inches. At 2 degrees it's 2.2 inches. As noted perhaps I misunderstood the OP description but rereading it still sounds like toe in to me.
timo482 - 2/4/2018 7:48 PM
an iPhone using the level program can measure lean - but not toe in
Actuall used the level app to set my lean in but was using a compass app to try and measure toe in. Anyway I worked out that the toe in on my Valkyrie with a 3 degree offset would be about 4.2 inches. At 2 degrees it's 2.2 inches. As noted perhaps I misunderstood the OP description but rereading it still sounds like toe in to me.
Quote from timo482 on February 4, 2018, 11:09 pmphone tool... cool, but ok for toe in?
not so much..
two aluminum 2x2 or perfect boards.. one set parallel to the bike tires as high off the ground as you can get it and have it be level and not bind.. another one parallel with the sidecar tire and the same elevation off the ground.
toe in is measured in front of the front tire and behind the back tire.
correct for bike tires not being the same width.. be careful. nothing on the frame is a reference.
im running about a inch... the toe in angle is itsy tiny fraction of a degree
to
phone tool... cool, but ok for toe in?
not so much..
two aluminum 2x2 or perfect boards.. one set parallel to the bike tires as high off the ground as you can get it and have it be level and not bind.. another one parallel with the sidecar tire and the same elevation off the ground.
toe in is measured in front of the front tire and behind the back tire.
correct for bike tires not being the same width.. be careful. nothing on the frame is a reference.
im running about a inch... the toe in angle is itsy tiny fraction of a degree
to